[Hartsock1986]

Well, late this fall I purchased a chrome FAIC pipe from Jeffo. I had contacted him and spoke with him numberous times on the phone. He at that time only had two pipes left, stating that they are no longer in production. He had two chrome pipes left, a NEW pipe, and a used one which was sent to a company for performance testing. After speaking with Jeffo it was decided that I would purchase the new pipe, due to the used pipe having some blueing according to Jeffo. I asked for pictures first, however, he insisted on not unpacking the pipes and "ruining" the excellent packaging the pipe was already in. Jeffo made it clear that these pipes are "as is", but insisted they were not damaged or anything.

I received the pipe along with a few bottles of chrome polish. I inspected the NEW pipe, and found that near the collector, it seemed as though it wasnt fully chromed, like part of the pipe got chromed and some didnt. It was hard to see unless you were looking for it, but you could definately tell that in the "hard to see areas" were not as shiny and chromed as the rest of the pipe. I wrote this off as my thoughts were that it was not gaudy and were hard to see unless you actually got down and looked at the collector.

I also purchased a custom map from Jeffo, built strictly for my bike and my riding conditions based on my elevation level and temp information that I had given him. A custom map was generated and sent to me that same day.

I installed the pipe using new gaskets. There was some fitment issues, as it seemed as though some parts were either missing or the pipe was not shaped correctly. We had to use an inch spacer to close the gap and get the rear of the pipe connected to the bike. The pipe seemed to bee too far away from the bike, and the bracket on my bike had to be bent to meet the pipe, then the spacer so close up the space. The front pipe was very close to the frame. With some minor ajustments and some improvising, the pipe was installed. We checked for leaks and fitment issues, but we seemed to have taken care of it.

We followed the instructions sent with the new PCIII USB Power Commander map custom made for my bike. A K&N air filter was also installed. The bike was stock prior to these instalations.

The bike fired up and sounded great. We checked for exhaust leaks and was not able to find any. We shut the bike down, took it off the bike lift, and I took it for a ride. By this time it was dark and cold, probably 40F my guess. I rode the bike back home, which was about ten miles, and parked it. The next day I get the bike out and come to find out the front and rear pipe had burnt up to the bung. I was instantly pissed. I grabbed the chrome polished and went to town. After about 3 hours of polishing, most of the burn was gone, however there was a gold tint to the chrome. I decided to ride the bike to the garage and try to figure something out or find a problem in the map. I didnt get more than 2 miles from my pipe and both the front and rear pipe was burnt again, just as bad as the first time. I pulled over and got a few pictures.

I attempted contact with Jeffo, however, he did not answer. I left a few messages. Later that day he called me back and I advised him of the problem. He stated he checked my map and the map was fine, stating that the map couldnt have burnt the pipe. The only thing he said was that I should have purchased a fuel treatment from him like he suggested, which would reduce the burn temp by up to 300 degrees. I told him that I shouldnt have to run a fuel treatment for the chrome not to burn. He then stated that I may want to jett hot coat his pipe then.

I wrote him a long email and sent him pictures as proof, however, he is not responding to me.

I was going to post the map on here to get your opinions, however, Jeffo stated that if I share the map with anyone I loose "rights" to use it and he will not help fine tune the map ect....

What are your opinions? I was thinking I have no choice but to jett hot coat the pipe, but what happens if I do that and it still ****s up the pipe, and maybe is a horrible map. Jeffo is not claiming responsibility for the burnt pipe. To me I think it is a piss poor chrome job to begin with, and the thin ass chrome couldnt stand the heat and burnt. Im so damn frustrated that I dropped a grand on this pipe and within the first few miles the chrome burnt.

What do you think I should do? Your thoughts and opinions are welcome.

Here are the few pictures i have.

 

[kimara]

Mate,

I would send it back. I don't know this pipe but I would not expect this to blue like that. You did not get what you wanted so I would send it back. Replace it with something that is better quality. Work out a deal with the supplier. I would not throw more money at it and get it recoated etc.

When I buy something, I expect to bolt it on and then ride away. You should not have to improvise and find work arounds etc. I tell the supplier what bike I have, I pay a good price and I expect a great product every time. If the supplier wants any more of my business (and anyone within earshot) then he will make sure that I am happy with the transaction.

Good luck with it.

Niko

 

[DESTRO]

Could you explain how you think the chrome burned? It looks to me like you bought a chrome pipe and it "blued" from the exhaust heat as you would notice on most single wall pipes that are not covered up with heat shields or ceramic coated.

 

[stever975]

.... What do you think I should do? Your thoughts and opinions are welcome. ...

I agree with DESTRO.

That looks like heat related chrome bluing and can't be avoided unless the pipes are ceramic coated on the inside or dual wall from the port on down.

 

[ElrodontheV-Rod]

Could you explain how you think the chrome burned? It looks to me like you bought a chrome pipe and it "blued" from the exhaust heat as you would notice on most single wall pipes that are not covered up with heat shields or ceramic coated.

Yea,that pipe is like that from the heat.A rich tune for the first couple hundred miles would have kept the discoloration down to a minimum.
Years ago I used to install real side pipes on Vettes,T-Buckets and other opened engine Hot-Rods.I found before installing the pipes, coating the inside of the them with grease,or 90wt oil would keep the discoloration down to a minimum,and in most cases none at all.
There is a product sold that is poured into the pipe and baked in that uses the same idea we had with the oil. I can't remember the name of it,but it is from the company that sells Cream Coat for gas tanks.I've used it on $500 mini bike pipes and it worked for me.I used the kitchen oven to bake the stuff in.

The way to fix this pipe now is with some shields.The bluing you have there is very common,and is why you see shields for most every pipe sold.

 

[V-Rod I FL]

Yea,that pipe is like that from the heat.A rich tune for the first couple hundred miles would have kept the discoloration down to a minimum.
Years ago I used to install real side pipes on Vettes,T-Buckets and other opened engine Hot-Rods.I found before installing the pipes, coating the inside of the them with grease,or 90wt oil would keep the discoloration down to a minimum,and in most cases none at all.
There is a product sold that is poured into the pipe and baked in that uses the same idea we had with the oil. I can't remember the name of it,but it is from the company that sells Cream Coat for gas tanks.I've used it on $500 mini bike pipes and it worked for me.I used the kitchen oven to bake the stuff in.

The way to fix this pipe now is with some shields.The bluing you have there is very common,and is why you see shields for most every pipe sold.

I agree with ElroddontheV-Rod.

You need to find out what is going on in the motor with the new map and pipe-K&N a/c installed. It looks to be too lean which is what Eldon was saying.

We need to know what your Air/Fuel ratio is across your entire power band and that can be had via a Dyno run or with the add on box hooked up to your box from Power Commander.

As far as a guarantee on your purchased Power Commander map, I wouldn't give it a second thought since it isn't working for you now.

Curious--Was there any popping on accelleration or deceleration when you went for your brief ride?

Regards

Jerry

 

[stever975]

... It looks to be too lean which is what Eldon was saying. ...

You can't guess operating temperature from bluing. An engine tuned properly will have exhaust temperatures hot enough to blue and show discoloration within the first few minutes of operation.

 

[Hartsock1986]

My appologies, when I said "burnt", i meant that the pipe blued due to heat. Missuse of words on my part.

As for the pipe, the pipe is ceramic coated on the inside according to Jeffo. Upon inspection there is a black coating inside the pipe.

My initial thought was to send it back, but I was advised this pipe is "AS IS" and there was no returns. I bought the pipe from the engineer who had 2 pipes left. I attempted contact back via tx and email, but no response. When I initially talked to Jeffo, he told me that I should have run his fuel treatment like he suggested, and stated that this would have prevented the blueing. While this may be true, I dont believe that I should have to run a treatment to reduce exhaust temps in order to prevent blueing. I purchased the custom made map from him, along with his pipe in order to prevent the blueing, as he told me not to fire the bike until the map was installed because it may blue. He is the engineer of the pipe, and the one who created the map. He claims this map is in multiple vrods and he has not had this problem using the chrome pipes. His solution was to jett hot coat the pipe. I would be fine with that if he paid for the coating, but since I have to fork out even more money to fix a problem that shouldnt have happened, I'm not so quick to empty the wallet. Im a bit of a picky person, so this is driving me nuts.

I didnt have much popping at first during my very short test ride, but the air temp was very cold. The next time I rode it it was probably about 30 degrees warmer, and I did get a few blips here and there at cruising speeds. I was concerned about "hurting" the bike, so I parked it for the winter after this.

Is there anyone one here that is running the FAIC pipe with a PCIII USB and K&N filter that would be able to compare my map? Wondering if I should just post my map for everyone to review and give me feedback. I may be able to put a sniffer in the exhaust and try and get some numbers to look at.

 

[ElrodontheV-Rod]

I understand your frustration.
I say it's time for the dyno.

 

[icreepin]

Well, late this fall I purchased a chrome FAIC pipe from Jeffo. I had contacted him and spoke with him numberous times on the phone. He at that time only had two pipes left, stating that they are no longer in production. He had two chrome pipes left, a NEW pipe, and a used one which was sent to a company for performance testing. After speaking with Jeffo it was decided that I would purchase the new pipe, due to the used pipe having some blueing according to Jeffo. I asked for pictures first, however, he insisted on not unpacking the pipes and "ruining" the excellent packaging the pipe was already in. Jeffo made it clear that these pipes are "as is", but insisted they were not damaged or anything.

I received the pipe along with a few bottles of chrome polish. I inspected the NEW pipe, and found that near the collector, it seemed as though it wasnt fully chromed, like part of the pipe got chromed and some didnt. It was hard to see unless you were looking for it, but you could definately tell that in the "hard to see areas" were not as shiny and chromed as the rest of the pipe. I wrote this off as my thoughts were that it was not gaudy and were hard to see unless you actually got down and looked at the collector.

I also purchased a custom map from Jeffo, built strictly for my bike and my riding conditions based on my elevation level and temp information that I had given him. A custom map was generated and sent to me that same day.

I installed the pipe using new gaskets. There was some fitment issues, as it seemed as though some parts were either missing or the pipe was not shaped correctly. We had to use an inch spacer to close the gap and get the rear of the pipe connected to the bike. The pipe seemed to bee too far away from the bike, and the bracket on my bike had to be bent to meet the pipe, then the spacer so close up the space. The front pipe was very close to the frame. With some minor ajustments and some improvising, the pipe was installed. We checked for leaks and fitment issues, but we seemed to have taken care of it.

We followed the instructions sent with the new PCIII USB Power Commander map custom made for my bike. A K&N air filter was also installed. The bike was stock prior to these instalations.

The bike fired up and sounded great. We checked for exhaust leaks and was not able to find any. We shut the bike down, took it off the bike lift, and I took it for a ride. By this time it was dark and cold, probably 40F my guess. I rode the bike back home, which was about ten miles, and parked it. The next day I get the bike out and come to find out the front and rear pipe had burnt up to the bung. I was instantly pissed. I grabbed the chrome polished and went to town. After about 3 hours of polishing, most of the burn was gone, however there was a gold tint to the chrome. I decided to ride the bike to the garage and try to figure something out or find a problem in the map. I didnt get more than 2 miles from my pipe and both the front and rear pipe was burnt again, just as bad as the first time. I pulled over and got a few pictures.

I attempted contact with Jeffo, however, he did not answer. I left a few messages. Later that day he called me back and I advised him of the problem. He stated he checked my map and the map was fine, stating that the map couldnt have burnt the pipe. The only thing he said was that I should have purchased a fuel treatment from him like he suggested, which would reduce the burn temp by up to 300 degrees. I told him that I shouldnt have to run a fuel treatment for the chrome not to burn. He then stated that I may want to jett hot coat his pipe then.

I wrote him a long email and sent him pictures as proof, however, he is not responding to me.

I was going to post the map on here to get your opinions, however, Jeffo stated that if I share the map with anyone I loose "rights" to use it and he will not help fine tune the map ect....

What are your opinions? I was thinking I have no choice but to jett hot coat the pipe, but what happens if I do that and it still ****s up the pipe, and maybe is a horrible map. Jeffo is not claiming responsibility for the burnt pipe. To me I think it is a piss poor chrome job to begin with, and the thin ass chrome couldnt stand the heat and burnt. Im so damn frustrated that I dropped a grand on this pipe and within the first few miles the chrome burnt.

What do you think I should do? Your thoughts and opinions are welcome.

Here are the few pictures i have.

well you mentioned that you added the air filter but in your initial description you left that along with every thing you told him about your riding style ect that you told him the air filter your going to put on. One question would be was the air filter an after thought?

Also I looked at the pics, they look normal but again if there is an issue and you did not purchase the other recommended items is it truly the sellers fault?

lastly I would never purchase a map with out having my bike dyno tuned and a custom map generated for this very reason. You purchased the items as is this could be a situation where this product while it will work for a V-rod isnt something that should be purchased for a V-rod. I know its hard to swallow but you arent the only one who has made a 1000.00 mistake when trying to get there bike running right.

 

[Hartsock1986]

The FAIC pipe, PCIII USB and the K&N air filter were all purchased at the same time. When I purchased the map, Jeffo was advised that these items would be installed, and I needed a map to reflect these installations.

Dyno run time would be great, but after buyin all my goodies, I sadly am broke and cant afford a dyno run, not with the rates the guys around here charge.

I spoke with another fellow vrod owner, and he advised that it might be best to ditch the "Custom" map provided by Jeffo, and install a Power Commander map KNOWING that these run rich... and fine toon from there. I could pick a map used in the most equivalent 2 into 1 pipe, install the map and test ride it.... making adjustments along the way..... not sure if this would get me a "perfect" map, but right now I'm just concerned with having a map that will not continue to blue my exhaust and runs without hiccups.

I refuse to ride the bike the way it is now if each time it fires it turns out blueing the exhaust again and again, no matter how many countless hours I spend polishing the Sh*t outta that pipe.

As far as the fuel treatment..... He went on a huge sales pitch about how this treatment can reduce the burn temp of the exhaust by up to 300 degrees F, increase my MPG by 2 or 3, increase horsepower, ect..... Dont quote me on it, but i think he said the bottle costs like 50 bucks or so. This would need to be mixed with the gas prior to each fill up, recommended in a gas can. So if I was to go on a long trip, i would have to bring this bottle of fuel additive and something to measure it in, getting the precise amount for each fill up, mix up the gas, then fuel the bike. What a hassle if u ask me.