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Discussion Starter #1
Hi Vrod world,

I have recently put a Sprintex blower onto my 1250cc nightrod which has a the SE2 cam kit installed. Has anyone had any experience with charging an NA cammed bike ? whats your thoughts on making it work ? I would prefer to keep them in but if its not worth it ill guess ill have to remove them and go back to standard. im currently running the DTT VRFI but am getting sick of it and will likely get the screamin eagle tuner put on and dyno'd

Keen on as much feedback as i can get
 

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Hi Vrod world,

I have recently put a Sprintex blower onto my 1250cc nightrod which has a the SE2 cam kit installed. Has anyone had any experience with charging an NA cammed bike ? whats your thoughts on making it work ? I would prefer to keep them in but if its not worth it ill guess ill have to remove them and go back to standard. im currently running the DTT VRFI but am getting sick of it and will likely get the screamin eagle tuner put on and dyno'd

Keen on as much feedback as i can get
Curious on why you don't care for the DTT? Don't worry about hurting feelings here as some of us don't care for AlphaN either. Not a SC expert but generally cams and reduced compression pistons make a better overall SC engine. Stock might be better then the SE2 in this case if a specific cam can't be sourced.
Ron
 

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Curious on why you don't care for the DTT? Don't worry about hurting feelings here as some of us don't care for AlphaN either. Not a SC expert but generally cams and reduced compression pistons make a better overall SC engine. Stock might be better then the SE2 in this case if a specific cam can't be sourced.
Ron
To be fair, the latest generation of the DTT does have a MAP based version of their device (no idea if it still uses TPS as well).

I had this discussion a few weeks ago with someone talking about how even the OEM ecu is MAP based, but also TPS based...basically a hybrid alpha-n/MAP based system.

None the less, I can imagine the DTT frustrations are (in no uncertain order):

Flaky operation (how's your idle and gauges?)?
Ridiculous condescending "support" attitude?
Lack of knock sensing?
Perhaps false advertising as to what features it really has versus what is "coming soon"? <--I've got a story about this one, but that's for another time and a drink or two.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Curious on why you don't care for the DTT? Don't worry about hurting feelings here as some of us don't care for AlphaN either. Not a SC expert but generally cams and reduced compression pistons make a better overall SC engine. Stock might be better then the SE2 in this case if a specific cam can't be sourced.
Ron
Ive had the VRFI gen4 unit for 3 years now and have had it running a few different combinations and as a unit and for its functions ive been happy BUT..

Ive had 2 persistent issues with this computer. the first is that my bike is often throwing P1607 error code which then doesnt allow the BLM tables to be updated. this happens 50% of the time (currently everytime i ride it ) so no bloody point having an auto tune ??

Second issue is possibly linked to the first because when i download the logs they often dont relate to the previous riding session ? i suspect they arent being updated like the BLM tables.

Ive tried so many different things to overcome the persistent P1607 error with alot of focus given to my grounds but still no luck to find the gremlin.

In regards to the cams im likely to persevere with the Se2 ones but yeah keen to hear from experienced builders or tuners on the point
 

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My Last Ride
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Hi Vrod world,

I have recently put a Sprintex blower onto my 1250cc nightrod which has a the SE2 cam kit installed. Has anyone had any experience with charging an NA cammed bike ? whats your thoughts on making it work ? I would prefer to keep them in but if its not worth it ill guess ill have to remove them and go back to standard. im currently running the DTT VRFI but am getting sick of it and will likely get the screamin eagle tuner put on and dyno'd

Keen on as much feedback as i can get
Running forced induction with wide overlap camshafts lets a large amount of boost to blow through the combustion chamber and right out of the exhaust pipe. On high performance naturally aspirated engines wide overlap is necessary to purge the combustion chamber and reload a fresh charge of AF. With forced induction engines that happens much faster so there need not be as wide of overlap.

Ditch the Stage II camshafts if you want the maximum benefit of forced induction.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Running forced induction with wide overlap camshafts lets a large amount of boost to blow through the combustion chamber and right out of the exhaust pipe. On high performance naturally aspirated engines wide overlap is necessary to purge the combustion chamber and reload a fresh charge of AF. With forced induction engines that happens much faster so there need not be as wide of overlap.

Ditch the Stage II camshafts if you want the maximum benefit of forced induction.
I appreciate you taking the time its exactly the feedback i was looking for. Who are the cam experts when it comes to harley that could recommend the best to go with a sprintex running standard boost (8psi)
 

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I appreciate you taking the time its exactly the feedback i was looking for. Who are the cam experts when it comes to harley that could recommend the best to go with a sprintex running standard boost (8psi)
Jones cams, but the cams are made in limited batches and unobtainium for the most part (especially his forced induction cams).

Want to make it easy? Put the original cams back in, sell the SE cams, and enjoy 165 some reliable horsepower. Unless you are drag racing I don't see the point of hunting down the cams unless you live at the top of the RPM range (once again drag racing) AND you are prepared to start rebuilding an engine if you drop a spring, reach whatever limits of your engine and tuning capabilities, etc.
 

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Tie One On
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Jones cams, but the cams are made in limited batches and unobtainium for the most part (especially his forced induction cams).

Want to make it easy? Put the original cams back in, sell the SE cams, and enjoy 165 some reliable horsepower. Unless you are drag racing I don't see the point of hunting down the cams unless you live at the top of the RPM range (once again drag racing) AND you are prepared to start rebuilding an engine if you drop a spring, reach whatever limits of your engine and tuning capabilities, etc.
:them::them::them::them::them:
 

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The Hawk
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If you are good at timing cams, you could slot the cam sprockets and separate the lobe centers more to reduce blow through and improve performance. You would have to be very careful not to advance or retard the cams so much that the pistons would contact the valves. I advanced the intake cams 4 degrees on my 1350 as per the advice of Eagle Harley and it ran really well that way.

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk
 

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If you are good at timing cams, you could slot the cam sprockets and separate the lobe centers more to reduce blow through and improve performance. You would have to be very careful not to advance or retard the cams so much that the pistons would contact the valves. I advanced the intake cams 4 degrees on my 1350 as per the advice of Eagle Harley and it ran really well that way.

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk
While I applaud your enthusiasm, I can't recommend he try this. I am well versed in engine tuning and even I would have to consult with an engine builder to feel confident in using slotted sprockets on this engine (too many variables in my mind).

Once again, what is YOUR goal? Is it just to run "great" or is it to cut a few tenths off your 1320 run? If the later then get a hold of Vreelands/etc, otherwise I still maintain the stock cams/degree is where you would be happy (and reliable).
 

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The Hawk
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Yeah, if you don’t know what you’re doing it’s best not to try it. V rods running aftermarket cams need to have them degreed in and there used to be a manufacturer that made slotted v rod cam sprockets, but I’m not sure if they’re still around . It is pretty easy to slot them yourself. Just need to know what you’re doing!


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My Last Ride
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Another option is to be patient and wait for me to sell the new set of Jones Stage II supercharger camshafts that I'm sitting on.
 

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Yeah, if you don’t know what you’re doing it’s best not to try it. V rods running aftermarket cams need to have them degreed in and there used to be a manufacturer that made slotted v rod cam sprockets, but I’m not sure if they’re still around . It is pretty easy to slot them yourself. Just need to know what you’re doing!


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Multiple hole patterns is better than slotting.
 

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The Hawk
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Multiple hole patterns is better than slotting.
That would not work as the change would be way to large, we're talking degrees of change here. Movement of 1/8" to 1/4" is all you need, a half inch would be a really large change.

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The Hawk
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Some guys in the past have run a stock intake cam on the exhaust side for better flow with a turbo setup. Not sure exactly what is required for the cam sprockets to make that work.

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That would not work as the change would be way to large, we're talking degrees of change here. Movement of 1/8" to 1/4" is all you need, a half inch would be a really large change.

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With two bolts and all of those teeth you could drill multiple alternate bolt patterns.

 

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Then how are you going to line up the timing marks?


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Make new timing marks to coordinate with the new hole pattern. A #2 carbide center drill does an excellent job of engraving. With a CNC milling machine you would locate the sprocket center, index the original timing marks, determine the number of sprocket teeth required for an adequate margin between the bolt holes and then rotate the hole pattern and the markings. The sprocket has 32 teeth which is a 11.25º separation angle.

It's doubtful that 11.25º would provide an adequate margin between the holes so I'll use two sprocket teeth or 22.5º for the example. For a 2º incremental advance you would rotate the hole pattern and marking 20.5º clockwise, 18.5º clockwise, 16.5º and so on. For a 2º incremental retard you would substitute counter clockwise for clockwise in the example.
 

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The Hawk
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Yeah you could do all that, but why not spend 10 minutes with a Dremel, elongate the sprocket holes and have much finer adjustment that works. Mine had about 200 trips down the drag strip and 10 years of riding and never had a single problem with it.


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Yeah you could do all that, but why not spend 10 minutes with a Dremel, elongate the sprocket holes and have much finer adjustment that works. Mine had about 200 trips down the drag strip and 10 years of riding and never had a single problem with it.


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I would never send an engine out of my shop with the camshaft indexed in a slot.
 
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