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Discussion Starter #1
First I live in CA and with ever changing rules, I don't want a piggy backed tuner.

So, are the SERT and Mastertune basically the same?

On the TTS site, I see that I can calibrate my speedo, but I don't see this function on the SERT. Can it make this adjustment?
 

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the mastertune is the newest product of the person who made the sert, it is similar but has many added features the sert didn`t have..
 

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Looking at ebay it seems that the mastertune is $100 - $150 more. Once it is tuned, I don't think I'll play with it. But since a thing to correct the speedo is about $100, the price works only a little higher for the TTS item.
 

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Can a tuner used to the SERT or SEPST be able to use the Mastertune in the way or is it a different approach at the time of tuning? Thanks!
 

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Can a tuner used to the SERT or SEPST be able to use the Mastertune in the way or is it a different approach at the time of tuning? Thanks!
I'm not sure I understand your question but the Mastertune software/hardware and the SERT software/hardware are essentially the same thing and both are products of T.T.S. Inc. (The Turbo Shop).

The Mastertune product is the current product from TTS. The Mastertune software has new features that the SERT software doesn't have so there are some new things that need to be learned but the software is pretty much the same as the SERT software.

In order to use a SERT hardware interface with the new Mastertune software you need to send the interface or PPU back to TTS and only some of the SERT interfaces qualify for this upgrade (e.g., the one I have for my 2002 VRSCA doesn't qualify).

I don't know anything about the SEPST hardware or software except that these aren't compatible with the TTS products.
 

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One the Mastertune you have a choice of a 28T or 30T front sprocket when you upload the new MAP. Is that what you mean by calibrating your speedo? As far as I know the advantage of the TTS is that you can save your original calibration in an encrypted format so you can restore later if you wish to.

I have both the SERT and the TTS and I use the TTS now. No idea about SEPST. One other thing unless you have o2 sensors you cannot autotune in TTS. My ride is a 2003 model so I only use part of the TTS programme as that's all I need.
 

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You just answered my question, thanks a lot!!!

I'm not sure I understand your question but the Mastertune software/hardware and the SERT software/hardware are essentially the same thing and both are products of T.T.S. Inc. (The Turbo Shop).

The Mastertune product is the current product from TTS. The Mastertune software has new features that the SERT software doesn't have so there are some new things that need to be learned but the software is pretty much the same as the SERT software.

In order to use a SERT hardware interface with the new Mastertune software you need to send the interface or PPU back to TTS and only some of the SERT interfaces qualify for this upgrade (e.g., the one I have for my 2002 VRSCA doesn't qualify).

I don't know anything about the SEPST hardware or software except that these aren't compatible with the TTS products.
 

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Question, would a master tune system with the O2 bungs and all that good stuff be worth a small shop purchasing to tune and tweak bikes when small modifications are made such as cams and or pipes? As I understand they have a full system that you can rig up a sniffer and everything and basically tune the bike as you ride (because it records data), making tweaks after you stop. Hope that makes sense.
 

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Question, would a master tune system with the O2 bungs and all that good stuff be worth a small shop purchasing to tune and tweak bikes when small modifications are made such as cams and or pipes? As I understand they have a full system that you can rig up a sniffer and everything and basically tune the bike as you ride (because it records data), making tweaks after you stop. Hope that makes sense.
If I understand your question, there are a couple of problems with this approach.

  1. The interface is married to the ECM. Even the multi-vehicle versions are limited to the two ECMs that the interface is "married" to. A shop could have "test mule" bike(s) or ECM(s) that different engines, pipes, or intake systems were used and then use the dyno to create maps but this would lead to the other problem:
  2. The "autotune" feature that the Mastertune has only works with the factory O2 sensors (and the 2008 and newer ECMs that read these) and only in the part of the maps where closed loop control is possible (i.e., low load, low RPM regions). It won't help in tuning bikes with new cams and pipes in the important high load, high RPM regions where engine damage is more likely to occur. To tune the high load, high RPM region would require wideband O2 sensors and a data collection system that could capture the wideband AFR values and knock information at sufficiently fast collection rates (about 10 Hz) to see what needs to be changed in the open loop regions of the maps.
 

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If I understand your question, there are a couple of problems with this approach.

  1. The interface is married to the ECM. Even the multi-vehicle versions are limited to the two ECMs that the interface is "married" to. A shop could have "test mule" bike(s) or ECM(s) that different engines, pipes, or intake systems were used and then use the dyno to create maps but this would lead to the other problem:
  2. The "autotune" feature that the Mastertune has only works with the factory O2 sensors (and the 2008 and newer ECMs that read these) and only in the part of the maps where closed loop control is possible (i.e., low load, low RPM regions). It won't help in tuning bikes with new cams and pipes in the important high load, high RPM regions where engine damage is more likely to occur. To tune the high load, high RPM region would require wideband O2 sensors and a data collection system that could capture the wideband AFR values and knock information at sufficiently fast collection rates (about 10 Hz) to see what needs to be changed in the open loop regions of the maps.
What I was looking for, Thanks!
 

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If I understand your question, there are a couple of problems with this approach.

  1. The interface is married to the ECM. Even the multi-vehicle versions are limited to the two ECMs that the interface is "married" to. A shop could have "test mule" bike(s) or ECM(s) that different engines, pipes, or intake systems were used and then use the dyno to create maps but this would lead to the other problem:
  2. The "autotune" feature that the Mastertune has only works with the factory O2 sensors (and the 2008 and newer ECMs that read these) and only in the part of the maps where closed loop control is possible (i.e., low load, low RPM regions). It won't help in tuning bikes with new cams and pipes in the important high load, high RPM regions where engine damage is more likely to occur. To tune the high load, high RPM region would require wideband O2 sensors and a data collection system that could capture the wideband AFR values and knock information at sufficiently fast collection rates (about 10 Hz) to see what needs to be changed in the open loop regions of the maps.
Would number 2 be a reason to go with the Thundermax system with the wide band O2 sensors over a SEPST that was dyno tuned?
 

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Would number 2 be a reason to go with the Thundermax system with the wide band O2 sensors over a SEPST that was dyno tuned?
I've never used a Thundermax but from what I've read here these have some problems.

Although they use a wideband O2 sensor and can auto adjust, some have had problems with this (sometimes the system can't produce stable correction values). From what I've read this is likely due to starting with a base map that's too far off what the motor needs but the limited number of base maps makes this an issue with certain engine configurations. I also don't like the loss of the ion sense knock sensor. I would still lean to running a Mastertuneª with wideband O2 sensors (in place of the Nernst O2 sensors in the newer bikes) and collect data while riding on the road (or on a dyno) and manually adjusting the VE values.

ªAlthough Mastertune appears to be the best hardware/software setup for tuning the Dephi ECMs, I’ve read that TTS could do a better job with customer support and I’m still annoyed that they’ve abandoned all the original SERT customers since the Mastertune upgrade isn’t available for SERTs married to older VRSC ECMs.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Although Mastertune appears to be the best hardware/software setup for tuning the Dephi ECMs, I’ve read that TTS could do a better job with customer support and I’m still annoyed that they’ve abandoned all the original SERT customers since the Mastertune upgrade isn’t available for SERTs married to older VRSC ECMs.[/I]
Since the SERT was under license with HD, I bet that has something to do with it. Have you talked to them?
 

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Since the SERT was under license with HD, I bet that has something to do with it. Have you talked to them?
No, it has nothing to do with the HD license. It appears to be dependent on if the ECM can use the VTune feature and the currently available VRSC *.MT7 files.

TTS offers an upgrade for "qualified" SERT interfaces. You have to download a "Qualifier" application and run this with your computer hooked up to the SERT interface and the interface hooked up to your ECM. The application will produce a SERT Qualifier report if your SERT interface can be upgraded. Only SERT interfaces "married" to newer VRSC ECMs qualify.
 

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I've never used a Thundermax but from what I've read here these have some problems.

Although they use a wideband O2 sensor and can auto adjust, some have had problems with this (sometimes the system can't produce stable correction values). From what I've read this is likely due to starting with a base map that's too far off what the motor needs but the limited number of base maps makes this an issue with certain engine configurations. I also don't like the loss of the ion sense knock sensor. I would still lean to running a Mastertuneª with wideband O2 sensors (in place of the Nernst O2 sensors in the newer bikes) and collect data while riding on the road (or on a dyno) and manually adjusting the VE values.

ªAlthough Mastertune appears to be the best hardware/software setup for tuning the Dephi ECMs, I’ve read that TTS could do a better job with customer support and I’m still annoyed that they’ve abandoned all the original SERT customers since the Mastertune upgrade isn’t available for SERTs married to older VRSC ECMs.
I have also read about the poor customer support. So for a common mod combo such as exhaust and a filter, if there is a base map thundermax should work well? As I am not really interested in logging and manually adjusting the tune, but would rather have the tuner do that for me. I had a pcv and autotune on my 09 f and it never seemed to run quite right, so i dont want to go with a piggyback on my new dx. Thanks for this info as its helping me make my decision.
 
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