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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Here's the first dyno my bike's seen.

Started out pretty good with just the latest factory tuning file. All that's been added in some fuel in the midrange to smooth it out and accommodate the V-mods to the SE Slip ons.

Baseline: HP = 109.7 @ ~ 8000 rpm, Torque = 78.6 @ ~ 6700 rpm.
Final Tune: HP = 110.9 @ ~ 7800 rpm, Torque = 80.5 @ ~ 6400 RPM.

The tuner spent most of his time working on the torque linearity and max torque in the midrange, where I spend 90% of the time. His equipment is an antique Dynojet with an old O2 machine and it hasn't be calibrated in a decade so it's really more of a reference for his work than a true HP number.

There's a lot more in the bike, especially in the upper ranges so I will be scheduling some time on a Factory One (Mustang) eddy current (steady state) dyno in the coming weeks. This guy has a brand new 4 gas analyzer and is really keen on getting into the V-Rod so he's going to give me a flat rate price and probably spend all day playing. More to come.
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
New Run!

Here's the latest run from today on a Factory One Dyno. These numbers are adjusted to represent an equivalent run on a DynoJet. This dyno steps through the RPMs, we used 1000 rpm increments for the pulls and extrapolated the other numbers to smooth the graphs.

Peak HP = 116.49 @ 8000
Peak TQ = 80.73 @ 7000

Not too shabby :cheers:
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
The graph is purposely smoothed because the brake dynos measure torque at specific RPM points rather than through a sweep. The only numbers we actually have are at 1000 rpm increments. the 500 rpm increments are extrapolated (averaged).

When you run a bike on this type of dyno you pull up to a specific RPM as instructed by the computer and it homes in on the rpm by applying varying amounts of energy to the brake. Only after it gets the same reading over a specific period of time does it actually take a reading. It's completely different than a Dynojet inertial dyno.

If you compare the first graph you'll see that even on an old Dynojet my bike pulls pretty smooth :) The difference in the programs (maps) is minor. I added a little more fuel in the midrange, smoothed the transitions and leaned it up on the top end. No modifications to the timing since I was running out of time. I've since cleaned up the map even more and done a couple of data recording runs up the street and the bike is running STRONG!
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Okie,

It's possible that a little leaner on top could add a few but the top end torque curve looks very good, most bikes drop off real fast after 8000.

The only problem is that flat spot between 4000 - 5500. Too bad that's where you spend 90% of your time running. The AFR looks good, maybe it needs some more timing (or it's loosing timing and backing off causing the power loss). Do you have a datalog from the runs?
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #22 ·
:notworth: :notworth: :notworth:

Superb. I may need to slide on over the Jims and have him tweek on mine. How much time did be spend and what was the cost (if you don't mind me asking).

BTW, what was your previous setup (pipes, PCIII???, etc.)
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #24 ·
brent_walkoviak said:
Took 2 days because wed. we had so much humidity from the rain it was causing problems, so he finished it today (thurs). Normally would only take him a day. Total price of removing PCIIIr, installing RT and tuning $292.
That's pretty reasonable. Again, what was your previous setup, before the TT's and cam that got you to 115 hp. Also, what dyno does he have?
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
Bueller said:
Jim's has a Dynojet model 200, we usually charge 3 hours labor for a dyno tune session @ $64 per hour plus parts
Bueller,

Does that DJ200 have the brake option?
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #35 ·
riverrattcom said:
My Dyno Results
'04 VRSC-B, Topless, D&D Full System, Race Tuner

I dont think my dealer did all he could, Seem like the dyno guy didnt know very much about it. They Dynoed it for 6 hours. Had trouble on the AFR arond 3000 to 4000.

I am going to check with Surdyke or someone like that to see if they have a real good dyno guy. Still Have alittle burp or flat spot around 3000.

DOnt know much about this, What do you think guys hows my Dyno Sheets look.
Give me your Opinion.

Thanks :thumb:

Also I have seen people post thier temp and stuff, Heres was mine
Temperature 84 °F
Humidity 68%
Pressure 30.18 in / 1021 hPa (Steady)
It looks like the were afraid to crank up the VE tables. It goes lean around 4K and you loose power. Definately didn't know what they were doing.

If you could get the 3000 - 5000 torque flat then you could move the entire AFR up and down to find the best power. If you can get a table flat torque curve then the bike will feel like a monster. Those peaks and valleys have no business in the V-Rod's power curve ;)

Overall the numbers are good but it sounds like it's by default since the tuner didn't really know what they were doing.

P.S. Don't worry about hitting a magic number. Tune to the highest number the dyno you are on will record and you'll be running with the big dogs (at least the ones without turbos and nitrous :) )
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #90 ·
I have to agree, those are very good numbers. If the ambient air temp in the room was that high then the intake air temp was probably even higher.

Their software should have been able to compensate. They also don't have the altitude and barometric pressure readings on the graph either.

Not knowing the dew point or pressure it's hard to calculate a correction factor but it's probably about 2% using a rule of thumb that each 10 degrees is worth 1% of rated HP. His estimates are probably correct. In fact, your intake air temp was probably closer to 110 degrees.

One thing I've noticed is the system on the V-Rod runs richer at lower temperatures. In theory the system should compensate and it does to a point but it's controlled by a variable that we don't have access to. Since your final numbers still seem a but lean (13:1 is a good power AFR in the midranges, You're over 14:1) you should have real good numbers in cooler air.

Overall, great looking graph.
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #135 ·
Sorry, I replied then realized I hadn't read your config so I edited my post.

You can release some of the top end by leaning out the map from 7000 - 9000. It's a bit rich and that's causing the drop in peak power. I've been playing around with that for the last 2 dyno runs and obviously haven't nailed it ;) The motor seems to like between 13.8 and 14.0 in the upper rpms to make power.

You can also see that I like the power where it counts, in the mid range.... I bet the Butt dyno is happy :ride:
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #151 ·
Classic example of the flaws of an inertial dyno. The dyno free wheeled as the shift was done. Since the drum was free wheeling the immediate thrust caused it to accelerate faster then normal for an instant. Since an inertial dyno calculates torque by determining how fast you can accelerate a known mass (the drum) you get these spikes.

Either that or you're giving Kaz a run for his money ;)
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #247 ·
I agree, you need the backpressure to bring that midrange torque back. You might lose 1 or 2 at the top but who cares, you're down at least 15hp @ 4000! You put 10 - 12 disks and the end cap on and I suspect you'll be over 60 hp @ 4500 rpm.
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #257 ·
Red-Rod said:
Stock 05, SE pipes partial mod (drilled 8 ¼ holes in each read plate), air filter, semi topless (cut front of upper box off). ECM upgrade is for 16 gauge pipes not SE flash. Gills box installed. Five runs all almost identical. HP 106 torque 73. Air/Fuel smooth. Any advice would be appreciated. I was hoping for a better hp than 106.
Well, first off HP is the measure of Torque vs. RPM and they used MPH with a factor so you really don't know the true HP since you don't know the true RPM. Tweak the MPH / RPM calibration number (which they didn't report) and you can change the HP to read anything you want.

Sorry but using an inertial dyno without an RPM readout to compare HP numbers against other bikes on other dynos is a waste of time. It is valuable as a tuning device and as a way to verify that changes you make have a positive effect on output.

To that point it looks like you have a lean condition that starts at 80 mph and eventually causes detonation and a timing retard around 86 mph. It seems to recover by 90 mph. It should feel like a flat spot around 6500 rpm. Add some fuel from 5000 - 7000 @ WOT, that should clean it up.
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #261 ·
sgtfred57 said:
Greetings Jan-Dirk,

Your bike is really performing well. Mine is fine, but not as strong. I have exact same setup. I have one older and the latest versions of RT. Would love to load up your RT file if you don't mind sharing. Thanks for all of your work on this forum.
There are multiple maps for your configuration (or with V-Modded SE's) in the EFI section under race tuner maps. Jan's is in there.
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #279 ·
101.2 in Phoenix heat and at altitude is a perfectly respectable number. What type of dyno was it? That can also affect the numbers.

I don't understand how they say they can't give you the torque curve, torque is what the dyno actually measures. HP is calculated.

It's also possible that if they didn't use an RPM lead to capture RPMs and were using drum speed and the bikes tach then your numbers could be off by as much as 5%.
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #289 ·
I think his signature should be Torque Monster :twisted:

You need to get an orthopedic surgeon on retainer so he can put your arms back in their sockets after each ride :D
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #376 ·
Elrod (Al),

Here's a thought. Save the $$$ on the tune and the RT and for $640 buy the 2 channel VRFID..... It's worth considering IMHO.
 

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SNAFU
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Discussion Starter · #447 ·
BrianVRSCR said:
Same Dyno, roughly the same conditions and the operator looks to have set the calibration correctly so there really isn't much to argue with. Whether these numbers would hold up on a different dyno is probably your question but since they pulled a baseline there is no arguing the improvement.
 
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