[o2man98]

Sam V,

I have looked into Delo oils in the past for the bike and my truck. They are very highly regarded on many fronts. I often read bobistheoilguy.com which contains much info on oils and used oil analysis. I just took a sample of my Syn3 w/ 2000 miles on it and am looking forward to the results.

The only thing with the thiner oils is the V-Rod is already knowing for burning oil. Just a thought. Although Kaz may be interested in freeing up that extra .6759 HP going with thin stuff.

Ken

 

[o2man98]

Sam V,

This is the oil analysis on my 2003 VRod with 2748 miles. I am using HD SYN3 oil since the first change at 601mi. I added 1 quart make up in the 2147 miles also SYN3.

I am a little concerned with the Aluminum but as its an aluminum engine this may be expected from machining. Also concerned about the high fuel but the rings may not be seated yet. Although I think if the rings were not seated I would have more insolubles from blow-by?

The additive package seems to be decent as far as anti-wears. The TBN was 7.6.


Miles on Unit 2748
Miles on Oil 2147

Current Universal Average
Aluminum 41 24
Chrominum 1 1
Iron 15 13
Copper 7 6
Lead 3 2
Tin 1 1
Molybdenium 1 9
Nickel 0 0
Manganese 2 1
Silver 0 0
Titanium 0 0
Potassium 0 1
Boron 242 231
Silicon 24 14
Sodium 4 4
Calcium 1279 1450
Magnesium 749 633
Phosphorus 840 877
Zinc 1063 1028
Barium 2 1


Visc @ 210* 60.6 82-95
Flashpoint 265 >385
Fuel % 6% <2%
Antifreeze 0 0
Water 0 0
Insolubles 0.2 <0.6

Thanks for your knowledge
Ken

 

[o2man98]

Low miles, Lots o gas.

If you look at my sample listed above you can see that I only had 2147 mi on my SYN3 plus 1 qt make up in that time and still had 6% fuel.

Keep in mind that my last few rides were rather short due to 30* temps and we know that the V-Rod runs a little rich when cold this may be part of the cause. I am just providing a personal example of how riding style may effect testing. Next summer after some good crankin on it I am going to send in another to see if there is any change.

By the way my oil did stink of gas, BAD.

Ken

 

[o2man98]

I am not Sam but since he has not been around since 2004 I figured I would try to assist.

Sam V

What is the generally recommend drain interval based on time?

Also, why is time a factor in an oil's life and does shelf life affect it's quality?

This is one great thread, thanks for all your time.

Matt, based on time along I would recommend changing your oil at least once per year, preferably in the fall if you will store the bike in the off season. The reason for a time interval has to do with the contaminants and their negative effects on oil. New oil contains acid neutralizing components (TBN) and over time combustion byproducts and other contamination uses these additives up. With a decrease in acid neutralization you can have negative effects such as the etching of bearing caused by acids in the oil.

Shelf life will vary depending on the conditions that the oil containers are stored in. Cool, dry, dark areas are going to provide the best results for storing your oil. Take a read at the following TSB for details on this.

https://www.amsoil.com/dealer/techservicesbulletin/storage_and_handling.pdf

What is your opinion of the Castrol R4 Synthetic ? My local bike shop gave me 5 qts of it to try out. He talked a good talk about Castrol, and said they had a motorcycle test facility.

Previously Ive been running Amsoil...which is better ? Castrol R4 or Amsoil ?

FYI: The only R4 that I am aware of in the US is a 5w-40 motor oil. Just be sure this is what you want to run before you run it. For a quick comparison read check this out. http://www.modernoils.com/media/pdf_files/g2156MotorcycleComparison.pdf

 

[o2man98]

Nope ! Im holding a bottle of R4 Castrol R4 FULL Synthetic.

I understand the synthetic part but what weight is that bottle. I stated that the R4 in the US is 5w-40 not synthetic or conventional.

 

[o2man98]

I rechecked the bottle..CASTROL R4 Superbike 5W-40 FULLY SYNTHETIC HIGH PERFORMANCE MOTORCYCLE OIL. Is this what you were wanting ? My question to Sam is...which is better...this Castrol R4, or the Amsoil.

All I was stating is that you need to be sure you want to run the 5w-40 instead of the recommended 20w-50. I never questioned the you or oil itself.

 

[o2man98]

I know what you mean. I finally settled on Redline oil.
View attachment 102887

The downside to the Redline motorcycle oil is it only has a JASO MB rating for the wet clutch. MB oils still contain friction modifiers which may or may not cause clutch slipping where as MA/MA2 oils are without this elements. This oil would be great in a dry clutch bike but not necessarily the best in our Revos.

 

[o2man98]

WTF?

Hey wait a minute! what is this then?
The oil analysis from members on 1130cc.com clearly shows Moly in the Amsoil oil for motorcycles!
There can be no moly at all to be a JASO MA, so Amsoil is a JASO MB too!?!?
View attachment 103147
View attachment 103148
Redline contains some moly, but it is MoDTC which won't make a clutch slip (not MoS2 which will). RedLine also has its own proprietary synthetic friction modifiers, and these will not make a clutch slip either. JASO does not have any category to classify these friction modifiers, but seeing it is friction modified, they have to call it JASO MB anyway. There may very well be a JASO MC category in the future, to account for these friction modifiers which will not cause clutch slippage. the JASO MA certification does not allow any moly of any kind, not to mention new atypical types of friction modifiers that didn't even exist years ago when the category was created.

OK, then how do you know that the moly in the Amsoil report is not MoS2? One cannot know such a detail from the basic testing done? Redline typically shows 600+ ppm of moly and you are worried about the 50-60ppm in the Amsoil. Please? Not to mention the 80+ ppm in Mobil 1 V-Twin, 50+ in Mobil1 4T, 10-20ppm in Golden Spectro, even Honda shows 50+ in their own GN-4. Moly is a generalized term and does not directly applied to whether an oil meets MA or MB requirements.

I know you have been trying to stir the pot lately, which is accentuated by reviving multiple old threads, but please try to understand somethings before doing so. JASO MA or MB ratings are frictional ratings for wet clutch applications and do not limit specific additives. There are MANY different types of Molybdenum available for motor oil blend and a simple oil analysis report is not specific enough to differentiate between the small differences and picks them all up as moly.

Here is some informational details on the JASO testing for you.

Evaluation Item Test Procedure JASO T 904 Standard Index MA - MB


* DFI (Dynamic Friction Characteristic Index-DFI) MA is 1.45 or greater / MB is Less than 1.45

* SFI (Static Friction Characteristic Index-SFI) MA is 1.15 or greater / MB is Less than 1.15

* STI (Stop Time Index-STI) MA is 1.55 or greater / MB is Less than 1.55

Note: An oil that does not meet all MA limits is classified as MB.

If you are interested in the Physicochemical properties that JASO MA/MB oils must meet I can provide those as well.

Also, Please watch the language. This is an educational thread.