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I'll bet it doesn't make good power being a 2 into 2 system. If this system existed as a 2 into 1, I'd be VERY interested! But $3K USD? WOW!




John
 

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Autobanmod
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Discussion Starter #4
Ketsugo said:
I'll bet it doesn't make good power being a 2 into 2 system. If this system existed as a 2 into 1, I'd be VERY interested! But $3K USD? WOW!
John
Dear John,
why would you bet and for how much?
p.s. I think this is just a dealer that likes to make too much profit, it looks as if they do not built the exhaust themselves.

Jan
 

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Judging from the website they are made in Austria or some such place and since they pay a hideous amount for any Harley over there in Europe (even the worst price-gouging US dealer would wince at the price) I'm sure a $3k set of pipes is normal. God Bless America.
 

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Jan-Dirk said:
Dear John,
why would you bet and for how much?
p.s. I think this is just a dealer that likes to make too much profit, it looks as if they do not built the exhaust themselves.

Jan

Jan,
Because NO 2 into 2 pipes for the V-Rod have made the power that a good 2 into 1 pipe has made, period. Just a fact, not an opinion. I would be willing to make a rather large wager that these pipes would NOT make as much RWHP as either the Supertrapp or the Turbotec pipe after being dyno tuned on the same bike.


John
 

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I wonder how hard it would be to make an elbow 10-15 degrees for the SuperTrapps. If they did something like this, I would do it.

Those Monstroso look ok though. I wish they had a pic showing the rear.

Leon
 

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spit happens
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Those pipes are Fugly. :yak: I don't like the look of Duals on a v-rod.If it was a 2-1 system then they would be better.The price is rediculous. :hmm:
 

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SNAFU
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I'll take a piece of that bet too (on Johns side). One thing I learned as an engineer a long time ago, take empirical evidence over theory every time.
 

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VrodG said:
John, Mark..... would a cross over pipe help?
Probably,
That's what the center section on the stock setup accomplishes. Slip-ons, whether V-Mods, SE V-Mods or others, make superior power to 2 into 2's. Having said that, the 2 into 1's still make the most power.


John
 

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Autobanmod
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Discussion Starter #15
Please consider the following:
As discussed in http://www.v-rodforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2206
the VE Maps for the SE slip on exhaust and for the 16" double barrel are nearly the same.
It is obvious that a 2-2 exhaust system will change the flow characteristic considerably but strangely this has not been considered in the map updates.
Are you convinced that SE did test the VE for the double barrel pipes???
Can anyone please find out or comment?
Why do you think that Porsche Engineering did the R&D for the revolution engine and not SE?

I have meanwhile contacted Porsche Engineering directly in order to get a qualified opinion but to be honest I have doubts that they will revert.
 

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Jan-Dirk said:
Please consider the following:
As discussed in http://www.v-rodforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2206
the VE Maps for the SE slip on exhaust and for the 16" double barrel are nearly the same.
It is obvious that a 2-2 exhaust system will change the flow characteristic considerably but strangely this has not been considered in the map updates.
Are you convinced that SE did test the VE for the double barrel pipes???
Can anyone please find out or comment?
Why do you think that Porsche Engineering did the R&D for the revolution engine and not SE?

I have meanwhile contacted Porsche Engineering directly in order to get a qualified opinion but to be honest I have doubts that they will revert.
The 16'' double barrel exhaust is not a true 2 into 2 seperate pipes, they have a cross over pipe that essentially makes it 2 into 1 into 2 (much like the slip on SE pipes, thus their map is similar). I believe the pressure from the other cylinder is required to make higher power numbers.

Pipes that are 2 into 2 are Sampson pipes that first came out for the V-Rod, and are a joke at the Dyno centers now.

Post what you find from Porsche I would be interested to read what an authority asserts about the V-Rod exhaust.
 

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Jan-Dirk said:
Please consider the following:
As discussed in http://www.v-rodforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2206
the VE Maps for the SE slip on exhaust and for the 16" double barrel are nearly the same.
It is obvious that a 2-2 exhaust system will change the flow characteristic considerably but strangely this has not been considered in the map updates.
Are you convinced that SE did test the VE for the double barrel pipes???
Can anyone please find out or comment?
Why do you think that Porsche Engineering did the R&D for the revolution engine and not SE?

I have meanwhile contacted Porsche Engineering directly in order to get a qualified opinion but to be honest I have doubts that they will revert.

Well I have a good friend with the SE 16ga pipes v-modded and dyno tuned with the PCIIIr. He's making 115.6 rwhp and also has the SE a/f and 28T pulley. That was an increase of 8.9 rwhp as his baseline dyno run netted 106.7 rwhp.

I smoke him on every kind of acceleration test we could think of, roll on standing start, 30 to 100, etc etc etc. The same person tuned both our bikes and my results with V-modded stock mufflers resulted in 2.3 more rwhp than his 16ga S/E's did.


John
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Ketsugo said:
Well I have a good friend with the SE 16ga pipes v-modded and dyno tuned with the PCIIIr. He's making 115.6 rwhp and also has the SE a/f and 28T pulley. That was an increase of 8.9 rwhp as his baseline dyno run netted 106.7 rwhp.John
Ok - good for you, but where's your point to my previous post?
2,3 RWHP constantly over the whole RPM bandwith?
That is not much difference and probably less than the measurement accuracy. Unless the runs were made on the same day: what about ambient influces like Temp or Air Pressure?
Have the VE tables been modified based upon lamda probe values or was it just AFR adjustment (PCIIIr)?
Please upload some VE Maps etc if available.
Thank you for your input,

Jan-Dirk
 

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Jan,
I never saw his dyno print out, but the real world (actual performance) is reality, and that's what we determined on the road with our side by side acceleration runs. Jeff weighs 10 lbs more than I do, but that was the only variable. We both soft shifted just shy of 9K rpm so I'm confident that my bike indeed does make more power across the rpm range. The tuning was not done with a lamda, just the PCIIIr. I'll dig up my map and post it in the proper forum.



John
 
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