Don't know about the Holymoto brace but I bought the Trask it's US machined, boxed steel and weighs 2 Lb ! Super strong but it did need some dremel tooling to clearance an area around one of the main bolt bosses. Got it for $ 197 ( half price ) off e bay. Fitzgerald has a nice pan and his girdle is aluminum - probably a lot lighter but I don't know how strong compared to the steel - also you might want to pin your bearings as cheap insurance, he does that as well.
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My Revo, she's fat & heavy - and needs a girdle.
Well I too pondered the steel vs aluminum expansion ratio, I'm not sure what the answer is but the steel cylinder liners are an example - the top of the stock liner is a light press fit in the case but the lower skirt is a loose fit with the O ring boss just about touching. So the theory is the liner gets hotter than the coolant cooled case area and the area around the skirt below and the liner grows to a snug fit ? I spoke to Ray Vreeland and he said the liners he specs for the 1320 are a tight interference fit at the top and .004 larger on the bottom for a snugger fit than the old Wiseco/Darton sleeve kit and they don't crack pistons or liners with the CP pistons. Having said that the differential temps of the surrounding case and the oil bathed engine brace would have to be considered to really know what the final differential of expansion between the two would be. The directions for the kit has you put red locktite on the case stud end, sequence tighten to 10-15 ft. lbs, install the brace/girdle, apply ARP Ultra Torque on the stud end, and beneath the nut where it contacts the brace. ( NOT between the brace and the stud boss faces ) then sequence torque to 10, 20, 35 and 43 Ft. Lbs. So theoretically yes, the brace and bosses could have some relative movement if the expansion rate is that different ( don't think so ) but 4 ARP studs locktited @ at 43 ft.lbs I doubt much and it won't get loose so in practice so should not be a problem. At 2 lbs I think the Trask girdle is a vibration damper/ pendulum weight as well and like the other brace/girdles may help to defoam the oil returning from the crank area to the sump. They work - ask the 200+ Hp guys. Roddy how does the HolyMoto brace tie into the oil sump/case bolts ? Do you have to use their sump that has reliefs machined into it ? Can't find a good view of their brace you got one ? :blahblah:
Well I too pondered the steel vs aluminum expansion ratio, I'm not sure what the answer is but the steel cylinder liners are an example - the top of the stock liner is a light press fit in the case but the lower skirt is a loose fit with the O ring boss just about touching. So the theory is the liner gets hotter than the coolant cooled case area and the area around the skirt below and the liner grows to a snug fit ? I spoke to Ray Vreeland and he said the liners he specs for the 1320 are a tight interference fit at the top and .004 larger on the bottom for a snugger fit than the old Wiseco/Darton sleeve kit and they don't crack pistons or liners with the CP pistons. Having said that the differential temps of the surrounding case and the oil bathed engine brace would have to be considered to really know what the final differential of expansion between the two would be. The directions for the kit has you put red locktite on the case stud end, sequence tighten to 10-15 ft. lbs, install the brace/girdle, apply ARP Ultra Torque on the stud end, and beneath the nut where it contacts the brace. ( NOT between the brace and the stud boss faces ) then sequence torque to 10, 20, 35 and 43 Ft. Lbs. So theoretically yes, the brace and bosses could have some relative movement if the expansion rate is that different ( don't think so ) but 4 ARP studs locktited @ at 43 ft.lbs I doubt much and it won't get loose so in practice so should not be a problem. At 2 lbs I think the Trask girdle is a vibration damper/ pendulum weight as well and like the other brace/girdles may help to defoam the oil returning from the crank area to the sump. They work - ask the 200+ Hp guys. Roddy how does the HolyMoto brace tie into the oil sump/case bolts ? Do you have to use their sump that has reliefs machined into it ? Can't find a good view of their brace you got one ? :blahblah:
Not Roddy but here's the HM brace.Well I too pondered the steel vs aluminum expansion ratio, I'm not sure what the answer is but the steel cylinder liners are an example - the top of the stock liner is a light press fit in the case but the lower skirt is a loose fit with the O ring boss just about touching. So the theory is the liner gets hotter than the coolant cooled case area and the area around the skirt below and the liner grows to a snug fit ? I spoke to Ray Vreeland and he said the liners he specs for the 1320 are a tight interference fit at the top and .004 larger on the bottom for a snugger fit than the old Wiseco/Darton sleeve kit and they don't crack pistons or liners with the CP pistons. Having said that the differential temps of the surrounding case and the oil bathed engine brace would have to be considered to really know what the final differential of expansion between the two would be. The directions for the kit has you put red locktite on the case stud end, sequence tighten to 10-15 ft. lbs, install the brace/girdle, apply ARP Ultra Torque on the stud end, and beneath the nut where it contacts the brace. ( NOT between the brace and the stud boss faces ) then sequence torque to 10, 20, 35 and 43 Ft. Lbs. So theoretically yes, the brace and bosses could have some relative movement if the expansion rate is that different ( don't think so ) but 4 ARP studs locktited @ at 43 ft.lbs I doubt much and it won't get loose so in practice so should not be a problem. At 2 lbs I think the Trask girdle is a vibration damper/ pendulum weight as well and like the other brace/girdles may help to defoam the oil returning from the crank area to the sump. They work - ask the 200+ Hp guys. Roddy how does the HolyMoto brace tie into the oil sump/case bolts ? Do you have to use their sump that has reliefs machined into it ? Can't find a good view of their brace you got one ? :blahblah:
https://www.holy-moto.com/en/kurbelgehauseversteifung.html
Ron
Revo girdles, $ 98.50 to $ 107.40 a pound. Step right up !
Ron yea I just found it on their website- it's under the "manufactures" heading, man that's (as usual) a piece of engineered artwork in metal - typical Holymoto ! It basically slips in between the main and oil pan cases I guess with a gasket on both sides ? It weighs 6 Lb. 9.6 Oz ! so it's the real super strong deal for S/C, Turbo, Stroker Big Bore High HP engines. Might be overkill for a Revo N/A build putting out 150 or less Rwhp, but some guys like to kill roaches with a sledgehammer. Roddy ? It's very heavy, costs like $ 525 plus $ 155 shipping + VAT tax $ 45 ? (if they don't exclude it for US shipping) so somewhere around $ 725 dollars delivered ? WOW ! Think I'll stick with my Trask girdle, only 2 Lbs for $ 197. Think I will buy their 2nd gear set though, has a unique semi helical gear cut ( not straight cut) they claim is good up to 250 Hp. about $ 407 plus $ 115 shipping, throw in the throttle shafts for $ 122, done. That airbox 5 axis machined aluminum scoup is INSANE !! like $ 1500 but ya gotta give it to those crazy geniuses, they deliver. :notworth: :blahblah:
Ron yea I just found it on their website- it's under the "manufactures" heading, man that's (as usual) a piece of engineered artwork in metal - typical Holymoto ! It basically slips in between the main and oil pan cases I guess with a gasket on both sides ? It weighs 6 Lb. 9.6 Oz ! so it's the real super strong deal for S/C, Turbo, Stroker Big Bore High HP engines. Might be overkill for a Revo N/A build putting out 150 or less Rwhp, but some guys like to kill roaches with a sledgehammer. Roddy ? It's very heavy, costs like $ 525 plus $ 155 shipping + VAT tax $ 45 ? (if they don't exclude it for US shipping) so somewhere around $ 725 dollars delivered ? WOW ! Think I'll stick with my Trask girdle, only 2 Lbs for $ 197. Think I will buy their 2nd gear set though, has a unique semi helical gear cut ( not straight cut) they claim is good up to 250 Hp. about $ 407 plus $ 115 shipping, throw in the throttle shafts for $ 122, done. That airbox 5 axis machined aluminum scoup is INSANE !! like $ 1500 but ya gotta give it to those crazy geniuses, they deliver. :notworth: :blahblah:
Put your $ where your stress is.
True for a 1/4 mile race bike. In the one hour of spirited street riding that I do you can make 360 ea. 10 second passes. That's probably 5 years of drag racing. A weld up might work just fine for that, but I want a 60K+ mile minimum street engine that can get it's neck rung on a regular basis @ 130 + Hp. A 1/4 stroker will add another 10-15+ Hp and 12+ Tq. and that must be reliable. I Don't trust a weld up for that. Unless you have an endless budget the way I look at it the $ should be put in the best possible place. A billet crank will help prevent a crank failure that will poke a hole thru whatever oil sump case & braces you have. Put the $ where it should be, and there will be no surprises. A $ 1900 billet crank - $ 500 overspent on a billet oil pan and $ 300 extra on a brace/girdle - $ 1000 on a weld up crank = $ 100 out of pocket for a true billet crank, a rock solid bottom end, just sayin'. :blahblah:
True for a 1/4 mile race bike. In the one hour of spirited street riding that I do you can make 360 ea. 10 second passes. That's probably 5 years of drag racing. A weld up might work just fine for that, but I want a 60K+ mile minimum street engine that can get it's neck rung on a regular basis @ 130 + Hp. A 1/4 stroker will add another 10-15+ Hp and 12+ Tq. and that must be reliable. I Don't trust a weld up for that. Unless you have an endless budget the way I look at it the $ should be put in the best possible place. A billet crank will help prevent a crank failure that will poke a hole thru whatever oil sump case & braces you have. Put the $ where it should be, and there will be no surprises. A $ 1900 billet crank - $ 500 overspent on a billet oil pan and $ 300 extra on a brace/girdle - $ 1000 on a weld up crank = $ 100 out of pocket for a true billet crank, a rock solid bottom end, just sayin'. :blahblah:
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