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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
The other day I was riding my 2009 Night Rod home and noticed it was running funny. At constant speeds it sounded like it was stuttering but when I gave it throttle, it was fine. About 10 miles later it through a check engine light and felt like it went into limp mode so I parked the bike and towed it home. After pulling the codes, I got codes P0108 and P1353.

Wanting to fix the P1353 code, I went to my Harley dealership and bought 2 new oem spark plugs to replaced the ngk’s I had in my bike and swapped the coils to see if the problem would jump to the other cylinder. Unfortunately this solved absolutely nothing and I’m getting the same codes and problem after clearing them and driving the bike around the block.

The only modifications done to the bike is a Vance and Hines exhaust paired with the fuelpak management system.

Does any one have any other suggestions on what I should be checking next? I’m stuck at this point and any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
 

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Two 2003 VRSCA's: CTHULHU is Black/Sterling, N/A ; EVIL TWIN is Anodized and S/C
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I've heard those V&H Fuel Paks aren't the go-to for these bikes. It might have taken a sh!t on you. Codes are MAP sensor and Front Cylinder Combustion. So you've changed spark plugs and swapped coils to rule out those components as faulty. Next look at your fuel system, and I'm thinking Front Fuel Injector may be clogged. So try swapping the injectors to see if the code moves to the rear cylinder. If not it could be wiring issues or the Fuel Pak itself.
 

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The other day I was riding my 2009 Night Rod home and noticed it was running funny. At constant speeds it sounded like it was stuttering but when I gave it throttle, it was fine. About 10 miles later it through a check engine light and felt like it went into limp mode so I parked the bike and towed it home. After pulling the codes, I got codes P0108 and P1353.

Wanting to fix the P1353 code, I went to my Harley dealership and bought 2 new oem spark plugs to replaced the ngk’s I had in my bike and swapped the coils to see if the problem would jump to the other cylinder. Unfortunately this solved absolutely nothing and I’m getting the same codes and problem after clearing them and driving the bike around the block.

The only modifications done to the bike is a Vance and Hines exhaust paired with the fuelpak management system.

Does any one have any other suggestions on what I should be checking next? I’m stuck at this point and any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Disconnect the Fuel Pack first and see if the issue remains.
Ron
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I've heard those V&H Fuel Paks aren't the go-to for these bikes. It might have taken a sh!t on you. Codes are MAP sensor and Front Cylinder Combustion. So you've changed spark plugs and swapped coils to rule out those components as faulty. Next look at your fuel system, and I'm thinking Front Fuel Injector may be clogged. So try swapping the injectors to see if the code moves to the rear cylinder. If not it could be wiring issues or the Fuel Pak itself.
I just tried both swapping injectors, and disconnecting the Fuel Pak but I'm still getting the same issue. Started to look at the wires and couldn't really find any potential problems but also not exactly sure what to look out for except for the obvious broken or cut wires.
 

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I just tried both swapping injectors, and disconnecting the Fuel Pak but I'm still getting the same issue. Started to look at the wires and couldn't really find any potential problems but also not exactly sure what to look out for except for the obvious broken or cut wires.
How dead is your battery? Have you checked it? Also check the ground wire coming from the voltage regulator to the engine ground. And check your charging system with the bike running
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
How dead is your battery? Have you checked it? Also check the ground wire coming from the voltage regulator to the engine ground. And check your charging system with the bike running
The battery should be fine, I had it on a trickle charger for a few days now. I’ll have to check on the ground wire though, thanks for that.
 

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If you drop a small amount of fuel down the front throttle body does it then run on the front cyl? If so then you are pretty much ruling everything out. Then you need to check if you have power at the yellow/green injector wire (which you probably have as the rear is working) Then check there is continuity from the injector white/yellow wire to pin 21 of the ECM. If all is good to there I am afraid you are looking at a bad ECM which would be the 3rd one I have heard of in as many weeks. You can also plug a noid light into the injector plug which will confirm the ECM signal or not. I would still check the wire even if the noid light test fails.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
If you drop a small amount of fuel down the front throttle body does it then run on the front cyl? If so then you are pretty much ruling everything out. Then you need to check if you have power at the yellow/green injector wire (which you probably have as the rear is working) Then check there is continuity from the injector white/yellow wire to pin 21 of the ECM. If all is good to there I am afraid you are looking at a bad ECM which would be the 3rd one I have heard of in as many weeks. You can also plug a noid light into the injector plug which will confirm the ECM signal or not. I would still check the wire even if the noid light test fails.
Thanks for explaining what I should be tracking down, really appreciate it. I should have some time within the next few days to troubleshoot some more. Will post an update once I get the chance.
 

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Sound advice from Coastrider. Fuel spray the dead cyl to see if it fires off. If yes well, noid first at the injector plug and continuity check from injector plug back to ECM. In addition to that, keep in mind that code can happen with coil too I saw it once when I forgot to plug the rear coil back in one time on my bike. . So, same test works on that coil plug to ECM check also, as I've seen you changed plugs and coils so not likely those items.
Ron
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
So I don't know what I did but I somehow made my problems worse...... Instead of going out and buying a multimeter and noid light, I decided to pull my injectors out and tap the ignition to see if there was fuel coming out (which both injectors seemed to be working properly). Assuming the injectors were fine, I put everything back together and pulled my coils out to examine them again but it all seemed fine, so I put everything back together. I fired the bike up and it was the same issues as before, to double check, I started taking it around the block but a few hundred feet down the road the bike started acting even worse so I quickly shut it off and pushed it back home. Now when I try and start the bike, it turns on but immediately backfires and dies. It does this with both the Fuelpak system connected and disconnected.
 

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P0108 and P1353, high map and no combustion could also be caused from an indirect condition. As mentioned , insufficient fuel supply. One cyl will crap out first before the other. It's just how it is. The only other things to cause the high map code is a bad sensor (not likey) or a major intake leak, or cranking the throttle on an engine struggling to run.
Checking fuel pressure is always a good first step when diagnosing EFI problems. It all starts there.
Ron
 

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So I don't know what I did but I somehow made my problems worse...... Instead of going out and buying a multimeter and noid light, I decided to pull my injectors out and tap the ignition to see if there was fuel coming out (which both injectors seemed to be working properly). Assuming the injectors were fine, I put everything back together and pulled my coils out to examine them again but it all seemed fine, so I put everything back together. I fired the bike up and it was the same issues as before, to double check, I started taking it around the block but a few hundred feet down the road the bike started acting even worse so I quickly shut it off and pushed it back home. Now when I try and start the bike, it turns on but immediately backfires and dies. It does this with both the Fuelpak system connected and disconnected.
Did you check for continuity from injector to ecm as they suggested? Did you remove your top air box and filter and dropped a bit of gasoline into the front cylinder and then crank it? I think it is now time for the multimeter and noid light. Listen to the wiser ones, they have given you excellent advise for troubleshooting
 

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Check out coiled spark plug connector wires inside the rubber boots that connect the coil with the spark plug. Sometimes they can move in the boot and not make contact with the connection on either end. Easy fix is to use needle nosed pliers and stretch the coil out on each end.

Sent from the Arizona desert
 

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P1353: Short of a destroyed cylinder (which I seriously doubt based on your description) that code = lack of spark or lack of fuel (or both).

Time to remove the fuelpak (I know you said you did this) AND make SURE that every oem connection is nice and tight/no visible wire hacks (I am always amazed at how bad people handle automotive wiring jobs), etc.

Fuel pressure: Easy to verify, go "rent" one from Autozone and hook it up to the schraeder valve on the fuel rail to verify.

Sounds like a fuel issue.....especially since the rear cylinder is firing, but the front isn't (think about physical distance from fuel pump/tank to each cylinder....I could see with a dying fuel pump just enough pressure reaching the rear, but not enough to really feed the front).

Best advice? Take your time. Try ONE thing at a time as introducing multiple variables/parts/etc at once will spin you into a circle of fun.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
P1353: Short of a destroyed cylinder (which I seriously doubt based on your description) that code = lack of spark or lack of fuel (or both).

Time to remove the fuelpak (I know you said you did this) AND make SURE that every oem connection is nice and tight/no visible wire hacks (I am always amazed at how bad people handle automotive wiring jobs), etc.

Fuel pressure: Easy to verify, go "rent" one from Autozone and hook it up to the schraeder valve on the fuel rail to verify.

Sounds like a fuel issue.....especially since the rear cylinder is firing, but the front isn't (think about physical distance from fuel pump/tank to each cylinder....I could see with a dying fuel pump just enough pressure reaching the rear, but not enough to really feed the front).

Best advice? Take your time. Try ONE thing at a time as introducing multiple variables/parts/etc at once will spin you into a circle of fun.
Its been a few days since I've been able to work on the bike, but finally got some free time. Realized my butterfly shaft was stuck which was causing the immediate backfire and shutoff and fixed that easily. I checked the fuel pressure and it held at 60 psi which confirms my fuel pressure is good. I then took out my front spark plug and tested to see if I could see a spark with the coil pack connected upon start up, and there was spark. I tried disconnecting the fuelpak again made sure all connections were good, and the issue still remains. At this point I'm grasping at straws..... I ordered a new compression test kit since I have seemed to misplace mine and will check compression once that comes in..... the only other thing that I can think of in any way that would have affected it was that a few minutes before the issues started originally happening, I filled up the bike up.... highly doubt that a bad batch of few would cause just one cylinder to misfire - but like I said, I'm grasping at straws and trying to think of anything that may have caused this.
 

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a few minutes before the issues started originally happening, I filled up the bike up.... highly doubt that a bad batch of few would cause just one cylinder to misfire -
Bad fuel can definitely cause issues so try that at least to rule it out. Odd though that only 1 cylinder is acting up as you said.
If the bike was perfectly fine right before that fill up you should rule it out.
It is easy to siphon the fuel out of the tank and get fresh premium (not regular grade) fuel from a different fuel station than before. A branded site that has additives in their fuel is what I would recommend.
I used to work in the retail gasoline industry and it was not uncommon for a bonehead delivery driver to drop a compartment of diesel into the wrong tank and not tell anyone as that was a fireable offence.
Also, if the site has an issue with water getting into their tanks then that can definitely cause issues. Seen that before as well but typically a car/bike wouldn't make it too far with a high water content. If the water concentration is at a lower level it could cause running issues.

Where you have already tried other logical fixes and those didn't work, I would definitely look at the fuel at this point before going deeper into the engine/electronics.

Good luck and keep us updated.
 

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Its been a few days since I've been able to work on the bike, but finally got some free time. Realized my butterfly shaft was stuck which was causing the immediate backfire and shutoff and fixed that easily. I checked the fuel pressure and it held at 60 psi which confirms my fuel pressure is good. I then took out my front spark plug and tested to see if I could see a spark with the coil pack connected upon start up, and there was spark. I tried disconnecting the fuelpak again made sure all connections were good, and the issue still remains. At this point I'm grasping at straws..... I ordered a new compression test kit since I have seemed to misplace mine and will check compression once that comes in..... the only other thing that I can think of in any way that would have affected it was that a few minutes before the issues started originally happening, I filled up the bike up.... highly doubt that a bad batch of few would cause just one cylinder to misfire - but like I said, I'm grasping at straws and trying to think of anything that may have caused this.
Well, you've swapped injectors, tested for spark, which takes care of two requirements. Low front cyl compression is the next step. Bad fuel will effect both, not just one cyl. Tight valve lash shows up as a compression loss on a cold engine only and your issue if I recall happened first when already riding and a hot engine so doubt that's the issue. A stuck valve would be a prime suspect however. Need to check for compression as the next test.
What's this stuck tb shaft you speak of. More detail needed on that.
Spark testing should be done with compression in play, not just in free air testing, to be sure it fires under load. I'm surprise you got a result in free air if that's what you did, as the system uses crank slowing (compression) to determine which cylinder gets the spark.
Ron
 
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