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Insane inda membrane
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I wouldn't do it. The stock bike is lean enough already.
 

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If it is a girl who goes topples it won't definitely harm your engine.
 

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Color me Gone
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vrodaholic said:
If you go toppless with no fueler will it harm the engine?

The gain is really small and there is no doubt your pushing more air through the motor so I wouldn't chance it without some sort of flash or at least getting the afr checked.
 

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I have been doing alot of reading on going topless, and, although half the guys warn against doing it without a flash or fuel manager, not one has said they have experienced or heard of people having issues running topless with the factory map.........hmmmm. Anyone actually have, or heard of, any bad mech issues while running this setup????
 

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Pat (Patrick!)
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Anyone actually have, or heard of, any bad mech issues while running this setup????
That's a $7,000.00 question! Do you feel lucky?:broke:
 

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Banned
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What year is the bike? If it's 08 or later then it shouldn't matter at all. The ECM will hold 14.7:1 AFR, or throw a sensor out of range code if it can't. If it's pre 08, it probably doesn't matter until the throttle is open far enough that the reduced restriction of the airbox makes a difference. I don't know where that point is, but I'd guess it's somewher past 7k rpm's.
 

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it's an 2006...pre 02 sensor...I think i'll do my changes this winter along with a dyno..season's too short here in Canada to have any downtime! You guys are right, why chance it.
 

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been topless

Went topless all last year . bike sounds meaner at take off less responsive in mid gears no change at highway speeds.Bike ran alittle hotter ,Don't know why but i kept track on dipstick themostat.This year Im back with top on..I lost intrest in sounding mean at takeoff and decided responsivnes was more important.:dance:
 

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Muscle Man
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Went topless all last year . bike sounds meaner at take off less responsive in mid gears no change at highway speeds.Bike ran alittle hotter ,Don't know why but i kept track on dipstick themostat.This year Im back with top on..I lost intrest in sounding mean at takeoff and decided responsivnes was more important.:dance:
probably because it was running leaner
 

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Premium Member
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It never occurs to "tuners" that air boxes are tuned like exhausts are. No airbox and velocity stacks are ok on a race bike tuned to make maximum power at WOT. A street bike at part throttle, accelerating and decelerating in traffic is a different creature with different tuning needs. The volume of the air box and the pressure waves that occur inside, along with intake length and exhaust tuning have to work together. But, you know, the engineers at Harley Davidson and Porsche who designed these bike, well, what do they know? Right?
 

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Premium Member
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It never occurs to "tuners" that air boxes are tuned like exhausts are. No airbox and velocity stacks are ok on a race bike tuned to make maximum power at WOT. A street bike at part throttle, accelerating and decelerating in traffic is a different creature with different tuning needs. The volume of the air box and the pressure waves that occur inside, along with intake length and exhaust tuning have to work together. But, you know, the engineers at Harley Davidson and Porsche who designed these bike, well, what do they know? Right?
I guess emissions have no grounds here? That is a HUGE hurdle for all engine designers. Convenient to forget that, right? These bikes are built to pass emissions first and foremost. So go preach somewhere else! The tuners are the ones that figure this out in real life situations... You think too much man. Common sense applies in more cases than you like to think. Everything is so technical with you.
 

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I guess emissions have no grounds here? That is a HUGE hurdle for all engine designers. Convenient to forget that, right? These bikes are built to pass emissions first and foremost. So go preach somewhere else! The tuners are the ones that figure this out in real life situations... You think too much man. Common sense applies in more cases than you like to think. Everything is so technical with you.
Emissions is a very minor hurdle these days. Many "common sense" or intuitive notions simply don't work very well. These are quite technical and sophisticated engines,not flatheads. The airbox is not primarily an emissions compliance device. It is a plenum.
 

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I know when I go topless, it hurts my engine more because I have to go that much faster to keep ahead of the Big and Beautiful Harley gurls that try to get me!!
 

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durata membro
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17,603 Posts
I have been doing alot of reading on going topless, and, although half the guys warn against doing it without a flash or fuel manager, not one has said they have experienced or heard of people having issues running topless with the factory map.........hmmmm. Anyone actually have, or heard of, any bad mech issues while running this setup????
Yea I have,but it was back in 02 and 03 when we were just starting to play around with exhaust changes.The Samson exhaust was one of the first after market systems.they are wide opened pipes and create a high lean mixture and caused enough problems that Harley started voiding some engine warranty's over these pipes.It doesn't happen immediately.It takes miles and extended high rpm runs.
The new bikes are lean at all the lower cruising ranges to pass emissions.Damage to pistons and valves could very possibly happen,but it will take a longer amount of time because the late bikes use o2 sensors.The ecm can make small adjustments,but none to great because of the antique system used.

Just about every V-Rod owner w a stock factory bike will notice a surge at around 2900 rpms.On a bone stock bike,using a dyno and a tuner that can change the ecm program will make this go away and open up 5 or 6 hidden hp to the rear wheel.Exhaust and air filters do not make horse power,tuning the ecm to match the components is how this is done,always has been.
 

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Premium Member
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Yea I have,but it was back in 02 and 03 when we were just starting to play around with exhaust changes.The Samson exhaust was one of the first after market systems.they are wide opened pipes and create a high lean mixture and caused enough problems that Harley started voiding some engine warranty's over these pipes.It doesn't happen immediately.It takes miles and extended high rpm runs.
The new bikes are lean at all the lower cruising ranges to pass emissions.Damage to pistons and valves could very possibly happen,but it will take a longer amount of time because the late bikes use o2 sensors.The ecm can make small adjustments,but none to great because of the antique system used.

Just about every V-Rod owner w a stock factory bike will notice a surge at around 2900 rpms.On a bone stock bike,using a dyno and a tuner that can change the ecm program will make this go away and open up 5 or 6 hidden hp to the rear wheel.Exhaust and air filters do not make horse power,tuning the ecm to match the components is how this is done,always has been.
I can change throttle response and eliminate part throttle surge on BMW Oilheads through small changes to the intake with no changes to the mapping of the ECM. Owners go through expensive gyrations to eliminate the part throttle surging that is so annoying, when the cause of the surging is the intake, not the mapping.
I can and have made power through increasing the size of the throttle bodies and making two small changes to the air flow meter of Bosch L-Jetronic systems. No other changes, stock exhaust. These changes makes more power than any after market exhaust on this engine ever will.
Modifying the ram air intake on older K-100's to a later model part adds midrange. A discreet little mod to that intake to partially defeat ram air at high speed quickens mid range throttle response. Intake tuning is very important to making good, usable power.
Yanking the air box on modern engines is not guaranteed to increase power any more. I am not surprised that removing the air box lid reduces mid range throttle response at all. You have just sacrificed the benefits of air box resonances to obtain a few more horsepower on top where you will seldom use it. For street riding this is usually not a good compromise.
I learned these techniques from a man who worked for an OEM in their R&D department. They are on my bikes and work.
 
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