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Lubedude
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213 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Thanks to Kaz, I have been pointed to this website. As soon as I get thru with my last kid's college loan 1st quarter 2004, I will be V-Rodding with you all. I work for ChevronTexaco as an lubrication engineer. Not counting a previous life as a mechanic, I have over 25 years of fuel and lubricant testing and developing under my belt, so although I'm primarily involved in lube related stuff, I also have a pretty strong fuel background. I also handled all of the tech service for Amoco's racing programs, including CART, NASCAR, WoO, NHRA and AMA. I told Kaz that if anybody has any technical needs regarding fuel and lubricant issues of any type, send me an email or call me at 386-775-9309. I'm not pitching any products here, I just enjoy helping out. I've even come out to various clubs and conventions and given talks on general fuel and lubricant technology. Those of you who are getting oil analyses, if you're confused on anything, feel free to FAX me your reports and I'll look them over. Be sure to include some history, and always try to get samples of the fresh oil to use as a comparison baseline.

I look forward to interacting with all of you. Also, once I get my V-Rod, I'll be counting on you all to help me out with technical issues, mods, etc. as well.

Merry Christmas to all of you.

Sam Vallas
Orange City, Florida
386-775-9309
Fax: 386-775-1033
 

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SNAFU
Joined
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13,094 Posts
:welcome:

Sam,

Good to have you. There have been lots of discussions on Lubrication, synthetic vs. non-synthetic, various brand claims among sythetics as well as the infamous (Fuel in the Oil) issues. I'm sure we'll keep you quite busy ;)

Mark
 

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Color me Gone
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27,333 Posts
Sam so glad you took the time to come by and pay us a visit, your expertise is greatly appreciated here.

Max
 

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Banned
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12,582 Posts
Sam,
It's about Time!;) Glad you figured it out"Thanks Max".We have Quite a Nice little group of Professionals,and Enthusiast so Your Knowledge and Expertise will be Gladly Welcome!I'm sure when you ready to get your Scoot we can all help you get the Best Deal and Really Show you how to Spend that saved Cash on a Few Upgrades!:diablo:
 

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Banned
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12,582 Posts
Sam,
do we really have to break in new motors"50 for 500"?What about switching to synthetic.How about high octain does it help or hurt? Whats the Pro say?:cool:
 

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Registered
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272 Posts
Welcome.....an oily Geezer is just what the Dr. ordered!
 

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Lubedude
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213 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Replying to Kaz.....
"Sam,
do we really have to break in new motors"50 for 500"?What about switching to synthetic.How about high octain does it help or hurt? "

1. Regarding engine break-in, the only consensus I've seen over the years is that the engine not be run at a steady speed for the first few hours of operation, and also, no idling, especially with new cams. Most of the guys I've worked, myself included, do a lot of "pulls" in moderate gears with coastdowns in gear as well. Try to ramp up to RPM, you know, 2-3,000, repeat a few times, 2-4,000, etc., etc. After a good few hours of this, the rings should be pretty well sealed. Another reason for this type of break-in and probably more critical is the transmission. Gears require a good running in so they can develop a comfortable wear pattern. This is the thin gray line you see when you take apart a gearset. Good loading and coasting along with moderate speeds play a big part in determining whether the transmission will last 50 or 250,000 miles. Also, after a few days of running, drain the oil and replace the filter. Getting the metal fines out of the machine is the single most important key to long life.

2. Properly formulated synthetics will always outperform most mineral oils, mainly because of their ability to:
. Maintain viscosity (film thickness) over a wide temperature range
. Remove heat more efficiently than mineral base oils
. Resist oxidation (cooking) that leads to acid buildup, deposits, and engine wear.
Our experience with all types of engines has shown that engines can be broken in from day one with synthetics. Or, broken in with mineral oils, then switched over to synthetics. This is what I do, mainly since I will be changing out the oil in a very short time, and only need it for a break in flush anyway.

3. Octane in of itself is of no benefit to an engine that is not tuned to take advantage of it. Octane is strictly the resistance of a fuel to detonation. This occurs after regular ignition and is caused by the pressure front of the traveling flame front increasing the pressure/temperature of the remaining mixture. In certain cases this can cause an autoignition to occur from the pressure, which causes the two flame fronts to collide. Instead of a nice "push" on the piston, a sharp pressure spike occurs which, at the very least, causes a slight pinging sound (sonic boom), at worst, the pressure spike and its associated high temperature will blow torch a hole thru head gaskets, pistons, etc. High performance engines are designed to run at much higher cylinder pressures than street engines. This is accomplished through timing advance, increased compression, power augmentation (super and turbocharging, NOS, etc.) Any combination of these changes can require fuels to have higher octane resistance. The only real way to know how much octane is needed is through extensive dyno testing using various timing and mixture maps with the race fuels. Racing fuels not only have high octane, but are usually formulated with heavier components that give more energy and tend to run richer. Engines that experience more power by just changing to these fuels with no timing or compression changes, are typically running too lean to start with and are simply running more efficient with the race fuel.

Hope this helps. One of these days, I'm going to put together an article on some of these topics. Meanwhile, give me a call or email me if you have questions.

Happy Holidays
Sam
 

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Riding around
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7,736 Posts
OK, whew, I'm blown away (but that's not uncommon).

Admins and other Mods - shouldn't we get Sam into a hi-perf thread on THE OIL QUESTION???
 

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Color me Gone
Joined
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27,333 Posts
Great information Sam, thanks for your time and sharing of information. I'm sure you will get swamped with questions.

My question for you would be, how many miles needs to be on oil to do an oil analyses and get accurate information from the test?

Max
 

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Lubedude
Joined
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213 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Hey Max, and thanks for the nice words. Great question, but right now I've gotta run and visit a couple of my industrial plants so I will have to get back to you on the post some time this afternoon. If you care to, give me a call on my cell phone. I've got about a two hour drive to the customers so I can talk to you for awhile.

Sam
Cell: 386-747-2668
 

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Lubedude
Joined
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213 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Hey, Max.... Back from the field. Nothing like a day at a paper mill and coal fired powerplant to keep the sinuses working.
Anyway, regarding your questions on oil analysis. For it to be a good tool, keep a couple of things in mind....

One, get a baseline test periodically on fresh oil so you have a starting point for your used oil data. Also, oils have a tendency to be reformulated from time to time and may have subtle differences in some of the additive and physical properties like color, etc.

Two, most people I know sample at each drain. Those who are running longer drains and will do intermittent "in service" oil analysis to "stretch" the intervals.

Three, make absolutely sure that when you pull your sample, that you do a hot drain and "clean catch" First, clean the area around the drain plug with brake cleaner. Don't wipe it down unless you are absolutely sure that you will not get lint into the sample. As you start pulling the drain plug, let some of the oil (at least a quart, or probably the amount that comes out before you can get the plug all the way out!) and take the sample bottle into the running stream for the sample. This is the best way to eliminate variables not engine related.

Be sure that whatever lab you're using is doing complete engine oil analysis. I'm not sure who you're using, but if you like, FAX me one of the test reports and I'll look it over and advise. Matter of fact, anybody out there with oil analysis concerns can FAX me a copy of their reports (386-775-1033) and I'll be glad to look it over. Just make sure to email me so I know it's arrived, and also give me a return email address.

Finally.... If you can, cut your oil filter apart and inspect if for metal and other contaminants. Just an added safeguard. Big chunks of metal do NOT show up in the spectroanalysis!

Regards,
Sam

PS: Any of you guys get out here for Bike Week?
 

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Color me Gone
Joined
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27,333 Posts
Thanks for the reply Sam, I was pretty sure from GM specs what was needed but I wanted to hear some first hand information on it. I plan to start a test on my next oil change to get an idea how my engine is wearing.
 

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Lubedude
Joined
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213 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 ·
You said GM, I'm assuming you've got a new car or hot rod? Anyway, let me know how the oil analysis works out.

Sam
 
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