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Hi,

True or false?

I've read on this forum that the 09 ECU self adjusts! Is this true?

If I put on the V&H Slip ons and a Hi-Flow K&N air filter does the 09 ECU adapt the A/F automatically with 15 minutes of riding it? Does it self adjust it's own settings and does not need a Fuel Pak, PCV or tuner?

If so what tuner is best?

Should I try it with out anything?

-BICEP-
 

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This is what I found on the V&H site:

A new development from the Race Shop - "The Competition Series Exhaust".
- Quality lightweight construction, weighs only 14 pounds
- Durable "Aluminum Oxide" finish, an exact match to the OEM heat shields
- Tuned length provides increased horsepower
- Baffles included
- Fuel Maps available (I would read this as needing a fuel mangement system, but some will tell you not required)
- Improved Ground Clearance


Also someone else from this site contacted V&H and 4 out of the 5 people he had contacted at V&H said yes a mangement device was required and/or suggested.

I have the TABS with a PC V w/ AT installed.
 

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I had the same setup on my 2010 Muscle and I needed to fit a PC V and have it set up on a Dyno. Prior to doing that it was running far too rich and backfiring on deceleration. It also had a flat spot around 4-5000 revs.
 

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The ECU should be able to adjust for the pipes, but that adjustment will always be lean because the ecu is set to run lean. Replacing the air filter with a gravel screen will only mater when you get out of closed loop, at that point it may be to lean.
 

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Hi,

True or false?

I've read on this forum that the 09 ECU self adjusts! Is this true?

If I put on the V&H Slip ons and a Hi-Flow K&N air filter does the 09 ECU adapt the A/F automatically with 15 minutes of riding it? Does it self adjust it's own settings and does not need a Fuel Pak, PCV or tuner?

If so what tuner is best?

Should I try it with out anything?

-BICEP-
I am wondering the same thing. Why have O2 sensors, etc with the original ECM and we disconnect them with aftermarket fuel managers? I currently have TABS slip ons, fuel manager, and hi flow intake filter. I think I will try the setup without the fuel manager and see how it runs. Anybody think I'm asking for trouble?'
 

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I am wondering the same thing. Why have O2 sensors, etc with the original ECM and we disconnect them with aftermarket fuel managers? I currently have TABS slip ons, fuel manager, and hi flow intake filter. I think I will try the setup without the fuel manager and see how it runs. Anybody think I'm asking for trouble?'
The stock ECM only has the ability to make about a 10% adjustment up or down from baseline. Fuel managers, and I will speak of the PC V with AT, has the ability to adjust lean out to 150% and enrichen up to 250% over the baseline (base map).

I did not like how lean my bike ran before removing the stock exhaust. Going down the road at 65 mph in the evening I could see that both pipes were bright, bright orange more then 12" from the head. When I put the TABS on, the bike ran like doogie dodo.

There have been a few that have said that their bikes have run fine when changing the exhaust or going topless without a manager. I don't see how but it's their machine.

If you are running a fuel manager without the use of O2's, that is old technology. Not saying they do not work, it's just the whole auto tune deal is recent and IMO not being properly utilized/tuned, YET!!!!!!!!
 

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the stock ecm has a fairly limited adjustment range, and the hd closed loop is set to run very lean (around 14.6 or leaner) so in the closed loop that is as rich as the system will try to reset itself.. with the hd tuners or the master tune you can load a proper map on the bike and reset the closed loop bias to run the motor richer in the closed loop, you can richen the map in the closed loop to about 14.1.. that makes a major difference in exhaust and engine temps..
 

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I am wondering the same thing. Why have O2 sensors, etc with the original ECM and we disconnect them with aftermarket fuel managers? I currently have TABS slip ons, fuel manager, and hi flow intake filter. I think I will try the setup without the fuel manager and see how it runs. Anybody think I'm asking for trouble?'
The ECM will adjust the fuel mixture based on input from the O2 sensors. But it will have a target AFR of 14.7:1. Most of us think that's to lean, and it will cook you at a stop light. The bike will run a lot better, and a lot cooler, if you lower the AFR. There two easy ways of doing that. The first is to use a SERT or Mastertune to alter the O2 sensor bias tables. The other method is to change the output voltage of the O2 sensors with a voltage divider. With either of those methods you can make the ECM hold an AFR of 13.9:1 in closed loop. The stock switching sensors can't read below that value, so you can't go any lower.
I've done this on my bike and it works, but I run stock pipes with the ends drilled, and a stock filter. I don't know if it will work with open pipes and a gravel screen, though I don't see why it wouldn't.
 

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the stock ecm has a fairly limited adjustment range, and the hd closed loop is set to run very lean (around 14.6 or leaner) so in the closed loop that is as rich as the system will try to reset itself.. with the hd tuners or the master tune you can load a proper map on the bike and reset the closed loop bias to run the motor richer in the closed loop, you can richen the map in the closed loop to about 14.1.. that makes a major difference in exhaust and engine temps..
I took mine to 13.9, which is the absolute bottom end of a switching O2 sensor, it works.
 

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I took mine to 13.9, which is the absolute bottom end of a switching O2 sensor, it works.
that was an approximation.. i max the closed loop on the bikes i tune and on our a/f instrumentation the bikes usually around 14.1 but like all things a slight difference in calibration of the o2 sensors would account for the difference we are seeing.. no matter the bike is a lot happier at the rich end of what the narrow band sensors will operate..
 

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that was an approximation.. i max the closed loop on the bikes i tune and on our a/f instrumentation the bikes usually around 14.1 but like all things a slight difference in calibration of the o2 sensors would account for the difference we are seeing.. no matter the bike is a lot happier at the rich end of what the narrow band sensors will operate..
I should clarify that the dividers I'm using should take it down to 13.9, it could very well be higher than that.
It does throw a sensor out of range code every once in a while, I assume some combination of variables drive the AFR below the readable limit.
 
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