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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello!

I saw this on the yahoo vrod group... does anyone have any more info?

Seems like a pretty big mistake on HDs part if it's true and if all frames are affected. :(

Rodman

<begin cross-post>
Date: Mon Nov 17, 2003 12:03 am
Subject: Heads up on 2002 & 2003 V-rod Frames!!

Heads up fellow V-rod owners! There is a problem with all V-rod 2002 and 2003
frames. The frame coating used on the first two model years is having oxidation
problems when it comes into contact with water for any period of time. This
Oxidation is happening at the molecular level. It looks like a light milky
white film on the frame. The explanation above is what HD Tech Services told my
local dealer. Harley is aware of the problem as that is why the 2004's have a
different silver frame coating. HD recommends a brake cleaner like solvent to
remove it. They also recommend trying it first on an out of the way place to
make sure it works. As for HD doing anything to help us, we are basically on
our own. The price of being Guinea Pigs, I guess. I am rather pissed about the
situation. HD chose the frame coating not me, yet I have to live with it.

Jim
</end cross-post>
 

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rodman said:
This
Oxidation is happening at the molecular level. It looks like a light milky white film on the frame.

HD recommends a brake cleaner like solvent to
remove it.
All oxidation (corrosion) occurs on the molecular level.

Brake cleaner will not remove corrosion.

I you see a "milky white film" on the frame, then it is not corrosion of the metal unless it has broke through the paint. Corrosion is a condition in which the metal is trying to return to it's original state (read dirt). It only happens on the metal, not on the surface of the protectant (read paint).

By that time it is too late. Sand (scotchbright) off corrosion and repaint.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Yes, I agree with your observations about corrosion, the original author wasn't very precise.

I suppose, however that the frame paint itself could either be porous, or chemically unstable.

The original author indicated that his bike was covered in what looked like dried skim mik. I'm wondering if anyone else has seen this? Perhaps a bad batch of paint is the explanation.

Questions:

1) Why does harly recommend that we *not* wax the frame.

2) Is this why the silver frame paint changed for '04?

I'm a bit concerned as I live in a costal area - very damp and salty.

best!

Rodman
 

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Color me Gone
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I have some of the spots on the right side of my upper frame but they seem like paint flaws and I doubt that they cause any long term problem. I know that at some point I want to do something else with my frame, I was going to do it in black until the 04 came out.
 

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SNAFU
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I saw that post too. I suspect the powder coating has a relatively high aluminum component and that's what's oxidizing. That's another reason, IMHO to put and keep a good coat of wax on the frame, regardless of what the manual says. BTW, paint oxidizes all the time, that's why there's such a huge market for car wax ;)

It amazes me how some people have to obsess on the negative and always feel like they've been screwed. Just ride the damn thing and be happy.:biker: (not talking about anyone here, just the general attitudes I've seen on the Yahoo group)
 

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Max: Is that where your your thighs rub the frame. It could be from abrasion from your pants. This coating will lighten. I noticed it first where the frame bag rubbed the frame, and the seat contacts the frame.

Fred
 

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V-Fred I usually don't have my legs any place near the frame but I first noticed the spots after a 500 mile day in which half of it was spent in a down pour that left me soaked to the bone and sometimes it was raining so hard I had to stop just because I couldn't see. So it is possible that my leg or rain suit rubbed it but the marks are only on the right side.

Max
 

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Max: The horn cover might keep your left leg further out. When you tense (like in corners, or perhaps riding in he rain) do you squeeze your legs tighter to the bike? I would think that a rain suit would be more abrasive than soft cotton jeans. In 1997 I stupidly bought a cheap rain suit that was plastic and for strength had a raised texture. I rode about 4 hours in the rain on the way to San Diego in March (also stupid) and the suit rubbed the paint off the tank, but only on the right side (riding postion or the movement of the leg braking as opposed to shifting?)

Fred
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
What kind of wax are you guys using on the frame?

HDs -no wax - mantra is weird??? What is in the harley gloss stuff that they recommend?

My frame looks ok so far and it's been in a 2 day long costal force 10 storm. The wheels didnt do so well.... gotta replace those asap;)
 

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I got these white spots the quick way when my whole bike was sprayed with sodium hydroxide. It does look like oxidation, it doesn't come off and I think Mark is right that the paint contains a lot of aluminium. Luckily for me I'm getting my frame replaced. I wonder if it will be an 04 frame?

I posted this on the VTF I think but it's worth another look - if you're brave enough
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Christine said:
Luckily for me I'm getting my frame replaced. I wonder if it will be an 04 frame?


Are the spots the reason for the new frame ? Perhaps painting would be a cheaper and more custom option.
 

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Christine said:
I got these white spots the quick way when my whole bike was sprayed with sodium hydroxide.

What Christine, were you making cookies again.:rofl3:
 

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Perhaps painting would be a cheaper and more custom option.

I'm not paying and I like my bike stock:D

What Christine, were you making cookies again.

LOL
Now you know my secret ingredient

Christine
 

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mjw930 said:
It amazes me how some people have to obsess on the negative and always feel like they've been screwed. Just ride the damn thing and be happy....
I agree 100% - some folks don't seem to be happy unless the've got something to moan about. I like to read the forums to keep abreast of technical stuff, and to get the opinions of fellow riders - but frankly I find that some of the tales of woe rather tiresome. We've probably all had some sort of mechanical failures on our vehicles at some time or other - and it usually is frustrating and expensive to fix.

Sometimes I also think that here in the U.S. we have gone almost too far in our consumer culture. As an example: in the last five years Mercedes has gone from being number 1 in customer satisfaction in the US to number 13, while in Europe Mercedes is still number 1. The cars are (with the exception of the SUV) all built in the same place - so why is it that US Mercedes customers are so disatisfied, while Europeans are happy with the cars?

Its supposed to hit 60 degrees here today - so in a little while I'm going to strap on my helmet, gloves, boots, and jacket and climb on my V-Rod. Its seen me through almost two riding seasons - and you know what? Its got a couple of water spots on the wheels; a tiny dab of oil near the valve cover; the frame paint is marked where the seat rubs it; and some of the fasteners are getting somewhat oxidized. Do I care? Sure. Does it diminish in any way the incredible rush I get from taking it down a twisty piece of highway? Not at all.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Guys,

Just to be clear, I didnt cross post this guys mail to bitch about the MoCo.

I live on the coast, (in Ireland) and I don't wanna see my bike dissolve in front of me. That's why I'm asking about polish/harley gloss and more importantly if this is a real concern... I'm not bitching about the product... this is my 3rd HD, and the best so far, despite some teething issues. ;)

Personally, I think it kinda funny that some guys get into the Harley thing and then expect everything to be perfect. They obviously didn't have their expectations set in the traditional way. I guess it's a product of the brand image that HD has attained and the premium that HD's command in overall bike marketplace.

The first HD I rode was a 76' ironhead sporty... I rode it, felt the thrill, and was about to buy it when the primary opened up and dummped oil all over the ground... :D
 

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SNAFU
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Rodman,

We don't usually need an excuse to bitch about the Mo Co :) It seems to come naturally for those of us who haven't drank HD the cool aid ;) (an American phrase that goes back to the Johnstown tragedy)

I think the heads up is great, more information on how to keep our rides looking and running good is a definite plus.

Since Harley doesn't recommend anything on the frame or acknowledge a problem we need to do some research to find out what the powder coat industry considers the best products to seal the coating.
 

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Automobiles are typically powder coated because Volatile Organic Compounds (VOC's) found in the solvents of liquid paints can be greatly minimized in a high volume production environment when using electro-statically charged powder.

I would suggest that you use your favorite non-POLYSILICONE containing wax. I like Griot's Garage Best of Show Wax because it wipes off clean and easy after it hazes. Put it on once every two months (or every 3). They even sell a Paint Prep spray that will remove your old wax prior to your next application.

But there are many great detailing websites and suppliers out on the web with good educational materials. Bike Depot.NET is one that is dedicated to quality scooter products.

And of course if you are true purists, you can always go to the long time favorite, can never be out-done... Harly wax
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Orest,

thanks for the infor.

Out of curiosity what is the problem with POLYSILICONE wax?

Rodman:)
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
hey,

Just noticed a post on the yahoo Vrod group. He stated that the difference between 02-03 machines and 04 is that 04's have clearcoat and the earlier ones dont. Interesting, if true, anybody know if this is the case?

Rodman
 
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