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Old 10-13-2019, 10:02 PM   #1
ejones565
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How Much Patience Do You Have?

OK - Hopefully this will spur some good convo vs. being considered a rant. I've been frustrated with the MoCo for some time. For years, I've been waiting for them to drop the V-rod engine into a capable sport-touring chassis. Kind of like Ducati's old ST4. Year after year goes by, and...nada

Rode to Hot Metal H-D in Pgh today with the wife...just a "run of the mill" ride - needed to pick up some new cold(er) weather gloves. While there, I picked up the 2020 "Big Book". Much to my dismay, there are literally NO sections dedicated to V-rod accessories. I guess I shouldn't be surprised, given that they stopped producing V-rods in 2017 - and they recently had a major revamp of the Softail line. The new LiveWire (which is an awesome bike if you get the chance to ride one) - now has the first 11 pages of the "Big Book".

On the other side of the coin...if you look at the planned new models - the "Adventure Touring", the "Future Streetfighter", and the "Future Custom Model" on H-D's website, I swear I see a tweaked 1250cc Revolution Motor (does anyone else see that?). I think the only real difference that I see is that the tank doesn't seem to be under the seat. Perhaps fuel delivery has been redesigned and the tank is back in a "traditional" location?

So - it begs the question. If your V-rod is getting long in the tooth, or if you're getting the itch for something new, but the "Milwaukee 8" just doesn't do it for you...do you hang on and wait a while longer? Or am I dreaming...

What do you think?
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Old 10-14-2019, 07:37 AM   #2
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The only model that I would add to my stable is the Streetfighter, IF (a very big "if") it receives a viable engine that can hold its own against the competition (Ducati and other Japanese naked bikes). With H-D's history of charging an arm and a leg for old, antiquated technology from the 1920's...I'm not going to hold my breath. For example, H-D believes that the new FXDR-114 is fast.

Hint: V-rods dust the thing without even breaking a sweat. Do us a favor H-D, put a real damn engine is this future Streetfighter (high revving w/ ~135hp). If you don't, the motorcycle world will simply laugh at you even more than they already do.
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Old 10-14-2019, 08:09 AM   #3
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Buy a used VMax while you wait.
I’m sure that thing would give you the smiles and tingles your looking for.

And of course their new 2020 book isnt gon have vrod stuff. You knew that answer already

We’ve all been waiting for a vrod capable replacement from Harley .
Sheet I’ve been waiting for cruiser style bikes to get inline 4’s so they can tear up some asphalt but that’ll never happen 😞
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Old 10-14-2019, 08:34 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CVO1 View Post
The only model that I would add to my stable is the Streetfighter, IF (a very big "if") it receives a viable engine that can hold its own against the competition (Ducati and other Japanese naked bikes). With H-D's history of charging an arm and a leg for old, antiquated technology from the 1920's...I'm not going to hold my breath. For example, H-D believes that the new FXDR-114 is fast.

Hint: V-rods dust the thing without even breaking a sweat. Do us a favor H-D, put a real damn engine is this future Streetfighter (high revving w/ ~135hp). If you don't, the motorcycle world will simply laugh at you even more than they already do.
Did you look at the Streetfighter pic closely? You don't see a Revolution engine in that bike?
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Old 10-14-2019, 11:37 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by ejones565 View Post
Did you look at the Streetfighter pic closely? You don't see a Revolution engine in that bike?
I saw an adaptation of the 500/750 XG series motor. Not a VRSC Revolution motor.

Harley seems to have taken the Revolution name for any OHC liquid cooled line.
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Old 10-16-2019, 06:47 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ejones565 View Post
Did you look at the Streetfighter pic closely? You don't see a Revolution engine in that bike?
I see a variation of a Revolution engine in there, yes. However, which version will we get? A version like that of the pavement pounding 1250cc from the V-Rod or a version closer to the anemic 750cc version from the new Street Rod, pumping out 60hp?

Quote:
Originally Posted by H-D Heathen View Post
I saw an adaptation of the 500/750 XG series motor. Not a VRSC Revolution motor.

Harley seems to have taken the Revolution name for any OHC liquid cooled line.
Exactly. See my comment above.

If H-D doesn't want to get laughed at, they will give this Streetfighter an engine with ~135hp and a 9k rpm redline.
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Old 10-16-2019, 10:20 PM   #7
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Wouldn't hold your breath.. I hope I'm wrong, but I'm betting <100hp, 600+ lbs, subpar suspension, and $25k..
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Old 10-17-2019, 07:05 AM   #8
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Wouldn't hold your breath.. I hope I'm wrong, but I'm betting <100hp, 600+ lbs, subpar suspension, and $25k..
I hope that you're wrong too and they give this SF the proper performance in order to compete.

Who in the Hell is pulling the strings at H-D?

Ok, they pull the plug on the V-Rod/Revo (apparently) because it could no longer meet EU's strict emission standards (Komrade) . Ok, so they no longer have the Revo to play with, so what do they do with the FXDR-114? They simply take a low-revving, boat anchor, Mil. 8 114cc engine off of the shelf and dump it into the bike. Laughable at best. That combo will compete with nobody outside of a Chinese manufactured 4-wheeler from Ace Hardware.

Look at all of these new bikes that they engineered; however, they failed to engineer a new EU compliant Revo??? Something doesn't sit well with me on this. Odd. Very odd if you ask me. Your air-cooled twins are 100+ year old tech and you're charging double for your bikes vs. the competition. You're digging yourself a slow grave. These air-cooled fuzzheads are in their 60's, 70's & 80's and you're still unwilling to get with the times. When they are all gone, so too will H-D. The majority of us young guys are NOT going to pay $30k+ for an 800lb/75hp chest freezer on wheels. For the sake of H-D, I sure hope that this Streetfighter delivers. As I stated, nothing short of ~135hp and a 9k redline will suffice.
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Old 10-17-2019, 07:09 PM   #9
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How much patience do I have? None at this point and Iíve given up on the v-rod replacement...

Not the thread for it, but... you checked out the FXDR? A pitiful and sad attempt, and Iím not alone in that opinion. Check out at what a STEEP discount the FXDR is selling for right now - brand now models still on the showroom floor that aren't moving...

Kevin
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Old 10-17-2019, 07:30 PM   #10
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I have a 2012 1098S Streetfighter and a 2005 CVO Vrod, my DUC dealer wasnt happy I was putting equivalent miles on my SF vs CVO, as soon as the Diavel came out they touted how much better and faster the Diavel is over any HD and I needed one. And it is Quicker/faster. I dont need that much quicker/faster, I am stupid and will likely try to use it someplace I shouldn't. IMO the 1250 is a good engine, no issues so far. Again, IMO, I agree, HD wont be able to compete without maintaining the same minimum requirements around the 25-30K line and need to be made in the USA or what is keeping me from looking at other Asian bikes? I love riding my VROD, but the DUC is way more power at the same price. One thing to point out, the DUC dealer still wants me off the HD, so its still on both ways as I am sure it is with the rest of the MFG's.
Competition is a good thing for us all. Even if we dont like the swings sometimes.
I'm up for another bike in 2020 and I have no idea what way I'm going at this point.
I am hoping HD gives me a reason to hold for another year and they are listening and paying attention.
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Old 10-17-2019, 11:11 PM   #11
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I thought the same when it was first shown but seem to recall reading it was not a Revo. Seems like HD could have produced the frame and the power plant and sold them naked for builders to customize or to do something where they are sold back through HD dealerships sort like Shelby did with Ford. End of the day I think EPA reg or certification were the barrier ---- Anyway I may just be full of shi4 and we might have hope still.

And yes the Livewire Fn Kicks
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Old 10-18-2019, 01:08 AM   #12
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I was pretty amazed that after a month long search for a HD to tour on how over priced and how they offered really very little to justify that price. The 2020 models even cut out normal things everyone would expect on a 25k motorcycle, what do you think about only getting 1 key as standard? No liners in the tour pak or saddle bags either. I guess they decided nobody needs 2 remotes. The M8 has had a few issues too. After getting jerked around a month, I found myself at some euro dealers where I was shocked at what you could get for the price of a sportster. Guzzi isn't for everyone, but I found new Californian 1400s for 12k sitting on the floor. BMW R nine T pures
For 11k. Many others too.HD needs to get with the program. I'm not going to spend more on a bike than my car. I love my Vrod. But HDs pricing, sales techniques, value, price gouging and lack of performance isn't going to get a new Harley in my garage. And their attitude that I ride some kind of 'obsolete ' machine really irkes &
Insults me.
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Old 10-18-2019, 08:07 AM   #13
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Long in the tooth...

Saw this thread about HD future projects, in light of the VRods demise. Mine is an 05 which I purchased new in 07, and it now is pushing 97,000 miles. No modifications other than a K&N air filter. Still seems strong. Full disclosure - it lost/destroyed a rod bearing just after the 5000 mile service. The technician at my local dealership rebuilt it. I put it on a dyno not long after that rebuild and it did 105 HP. So I guess the engine really has 92,000. When I started doing longer trips I wished I had something with a larger tank, but overall itís been a great bike.

I did replace the wheels a few years ago with lighter alloy spoked HD models, same size, which seemed to improve the handling quite a bit. The original wheels were amazingly heavy.
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Old 10-18-2019, 04:27 PM   #14
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You can try to force a ballerina to be a power lifter, and you can try to force a power lifter to be a ballerina, but, like, why?!

If you can afford to, get a second bike. I have a really cheap 2nd bike for my "other" riding needs. Mostly, I don't find my Night Rod to be utilitarian at all, so I spent $1,300 on this weird thing:



Between the top case on the back and the storage under the seat, I can fit two three quarter helmets two full face helmets and a gym bag or lunch box.

Not to mention, with those three wheels it's the most stable thing I've ever been on that still actually really leans. That stability comes in handy when you live in Canada and the weather is cold, wet, and rain or snow covered for what feels like 8 months out of the year.



here's a lean angle pic I couldn't get to work: http://members.modernvespa.net/canop...3_lean_101.png

The third wheel means you can lean the hell out of it even at high speeds and do some really crazy shit on it. I also noticed in brutally violent cross winds on the highway, that would give even my 620 lb Night Rod a hard time, this thing feels firmly planted.

Insurance is only $200 per year, and I'm pretty sure I can get back what I paid for if I was ever to sell it.

Sometimes it's better to have a second, cheap option, than to try to make a VRSC into something it's not.
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Old 10-24-2019, 07:56 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CVO1 View Post
I see a variation of a Revolution engine in there, yes. However, which version will we get? A version like that of the pavement pounding 1250cc from the V-Rod or a version closer to the anemic 750cc version from the new Street Rod, pumping out 60hp?



Exactly. See my comment above.

If H-D doesn't want to get laughed at, they will give this Streetfighter an engine with ~135hp and a 9k rpm redline.
I'm not even looking at Harley for my next motorcycle if performance is a factor. If I want to buy a Harley just for the nostalgia of the Harley name.... then I'll get a wimpy Harley again.

If I really want performance without feeling like i am on a crotch rocket..... then 2500CC here I come!!! https://www.triumphmotorcycles.com/m...ket-3/rocket-3

Harley has already came out publicly and stated they are moving towards "demand" which is utilitarian, and fuel economical.... err i mean electric!

I will not hold my breath waiting for something worthy to replace Dyna's or VRSC's. I seriously doubt it will happen. looks like nothing but touring, and wimpy from now on....
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