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Old 12-20-2012, 03:05 AM   #181
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Originally Posted by luxlamf View Post
Plus the BMW Loyalists are right up there with being Out Of Their Minds about "Tradition" and other garbage like the HD Stooges are so any changes t the bikes are regarded as tyranny.
Well, no horse in this race really but that is what happens when you've been riding for 30 years or more. You settle in to needs or what works for you.

You'll see in another 25 years what they mean!
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Old 12-20-2012, 08:35 AM   #182
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Well, no horse in this race really but that is what happens when you've been riding for 30 years or more. You settle in to needs or what works for you.

You'll see in another 25 years what they mean!
Precisely. A friend of mine hurried and bought a new Harley when he heard that they were changing to fuel injection because he didn't know how to work on it, even though it's a better system. That is just the old school, resistant to change thinking, that keeps Harley away from developing new age bikes.
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Old 12-20-2012, 10:04 AM   #183
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THis is the last year for the Air cooled BMW Air/oil-cooled flat twin ('Boxer') 4-stroke engine in the K1200 and being replaced by the R1200S Air/liquid-cooled four stroke flat twin engine, double overhead camshaft.
No Luxy. The oilhead will be replaced with a new liquid cooled flat twin first on the R1200GS, probably mid year 2013. It will take a couple of years for the other flat twins, the RT and S, to follow suit.
The K series of bikes have been liquid cooled fours and triples since day one. The K1200 was replaced by the K1300 a few years ago.
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Old 12-20-2012, 10:14 AM   #184
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Originally Posted by luxlamf View Post
Plus the BMW Loyalists are right up there with being Out Of Their Minds about "Tradition" and other garbage like the HD Stooges are so any changes t the bikes are regarded as tyranny.
Not so much Luxy. Look at what BMW sells. They have traditional shaft driven flat twins, sure, but they sell across the frame in-line fours, one a sport touring shaftie and the other a chain driven supersport that is the basis of a World Superbike effort. There are a variety of dual sport bikes in 1200, 800 and 650 cc guises using flat twin, parallel twin and big bore single engine configurations, plus a 650 cc motard style bike, a pair of massive six zylinder tourers, the excellent F800ST sport tourer with a parallel twin engine and now a pair of scooters. Plus, they own Husqvarna.

Alone among motorcycle manufacturers BMW has expanded both total sales and market share all through the depression and they did this by offering products in non traditional markets to attract new riders to the fold. The BMW traditionalists are few and far between now, and they aren't getting any younger. Today BMW Motorrad has a better business model, arguably, than Harley Davidson does and HD management I'm sure can see this but they do not see themselves as anything but a cruiser manufacturer. Their imagination does not extend beyond their niche.
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Old 12-20-2012, 11:08 AM   #185
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Originally Posted by Philthy View Post
Not so much Luxy. Look at what BMW sells. They have traditional shaft driven flat twins, sure, but they sell across the frame in-line fours, one a sport touring shaftie and the other a chain driven supersport that is the basis of a World Superbike effort. There are a variety of dual sport bikes in 1200, 800 and 650 cc guises using flat twin, parallel twin and big bore single engine configurations, plus a 650 cc motard style bike, a pair of massive six zylinder tourers, the excellent F800ST sport tourer with a parallel twin engine and now a pair of scooters. Plus, they own Husqvarna.

Alone among motorcycle manufacturers BMW has expanded both total sales and market share all through the depression and they did this by offering products in non traditional markets to attract new riders to the fold. The BMW traditionalists are few and far between now, and they aren't getting any younger. Today BMW Motorrad has a better business model, arguably, than Harley Davidson does and HD management I'm sure can see this but they do not see themselves as anything but a cruiser manufacturer. Their imagination does not extend beyond their niche.
JUst because BMW is Smarter then HD and instead of Giving in to the stupidity and instead just created more bikes doesn't mean they don't have the loyalists. I have met some, seen them interviewed in documentarie etc..
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Old 12-20-2012, 11:29 AM   #186
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Originally Posted by luxlamf View Post
JUst because BMW is Smarter then HD and instead of Giving in to the stupidity and instead just created more bikes doesn't mean they don't have the loyalists. I have met some, seen them interviewed in documentarie etc..
They all do. Period. And all are equally arrogant. although only some can back it up.
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Old 12-20-2012, 12:39 PM   #187
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vrods

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Originally Posted by KenG View Post
Would you like your blankie now so you can take your nap?

You sound like a 2 year old throwing his little tantrum with this tired old satire of how only you and a few others own "VRODS" everything else is a Revo powered bike.

You might as well join the local HOG club because you sound like 90% of the members. HOG bashes anything not Big Twin, LUX-HOG bashes anything not a 2002-2003 VRSC.


Getting to the OP question, YES! Looked at a used Cross Bones yesterday. If bought will be my 7th. Got to remind you all that if it weren’t for the pirates (lately) and the 1%ers (during the lean and AMF years) you all would be riding imports. Victory only came to the USA to get an American flag on it, would never have happened with out the MoCo’s success.
BTW: I've owned many other brands and consider a good bike one that suits my intended purpose when I buy it.
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Old 12-20-2012, 12:48 PM   #188
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I rode my 03 from Phoenix to Denver and back. Then I rode from Phoenix to the Grand Tetons and back. Then I sold it. It's a great bike just not for my needs. Hard bags and good looks, Road King hands down. The best Universal American Motorcycle.

Opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one and you know the other guy's stinks
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Old 12-20-2012, 01:03 PM   #189
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I bought a Street Glide this year, thinking I would sell my 03 VRSCA to help offset the financial damage. I can't bring myself to sell the V-Rod. Both bikes put a smile on my face for different reasons. H-D missed the boat by not paying more attention to how the V-Rod sounds. If the V-Rod had an exhaust system that sounded more like the V-Mod offerings, they would have been unable to keep up with demand....

IMHO nobody can compete with H-D in regard to raw style and paint. The fact that their bikes are just plain fun to ride is icing on the cake.
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Old 12-20-2012, 01:07 PM   #190
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Originally Posted by grandpawgriz View Post


Getting to the OP question, YES! Looked at a used Cross Bones yesterday. If bought will be my 7th. Got to remind you all that if it weren’t for the pirates (lately) and the 1%ers (during the lean and AMF years) you all would be riding imports. Victory only came to the USA to get an American flag on it, would never have happened with out the MoCo’s success.
BTW: I've owned many other brands and consider a good bike one that suits my intended purpose when I buy it.
You left out the Tariff imposed when HD asked for it because its ass was being kicked by Imports. (Once again, President Reagan chose to sacrifice free trade and economic prosperity to short-term political goals). To their defense they also asked for the tariffs removal in 1987 because business picked up.

"What has become known as the "Harley Law" was the resulting finding of the ITC that imports were a contributing cause of injury to the domestic heavyweight motorcycle industry. The ITC recommended to then “President Ronald Reagan that import duties be increased for a period of five years. Duties were to be raised to 45 percent the first year (1983), with the duty declining steadily over each following year until reaching 10 percent in the fifth and final year of protection (1988). "
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Old 12-20-2012, 01:18 PM   #191
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"You left out the Tariff imposed when HD asked for it because its ass was being kicked by Imports."

Good business and legal. Free trade is only free trade when nothing stands in the way in both directions! Our goods still don’t have the access else where that the world enjoys here! Elsewhere the consumer isn't clamoring for the latest plastic from somewhere that only recently the producers of said have learned of and are getting closer to paying a living wage.
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Old 12-20-2012, 01:31 PM   #192
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grandpawgriz View Post
"You left out the Tariff imposed when HD asked for it because its ass was being kicked by Imports."

Good business and legal. Free trade is only free trade when nothing stands in the way in both directions! Our goods still don’t have the access else where that the world enjoys here! Elsewhere the consumer isn't clamoring for the latest plastic for somewhere where only recently the producers of said have learned of and are getting closer to a paying living wage.
Had nothing to do with the Bikes they where peddling out of WI at the time? there where 3 bike builders of any size back then if I am correct, HD, Honda and Kawi. The 1980 "Line Up"

1980 Goldwing:

ENGINE SPECS

Engine Type: 1085 cc, liquid cooled, Boxer Four, 4-stroke
Engine Bore and Stroke: 75 mm x 61.4 mm
Valves 2 valves/cylinder
Claimed Horsepower: 81 hp (60.4 kW) @ 7000 rpm
Maximum Torque: 88 Nm (64.9 ft. lbs) @ 5500 rpm


1980 Kawasaki KZ1300

ENGINE SPECS

Engine Type: 1286 cc, liquid cooled, 6 - cylinders in line, 4-stroke
Engine Bore and Stroke: 62 mm x 71 mm
Valves 4 valves/cylinder
Claimed Horsepower: 120 hp (89.5 kW) @ 8000 rpm
Maximum Torque: 116 Nm (85.6 ft. lbs) @ 6500 rpm

Transmission type: 5 speed

Harley-Davidson FLH 1340 Electra Glide

Displacement: 1337.00 ccm (81.58 cubic inches)
Engine type: V2, four-stroke
Power: 67.00 HP (48.9 kW)) @ 6000 RPM
Top speed: 150.0 km/h (93.2 mph)
Compression: 7.4:1
Bore x stroke: 88.8 x 108.0 mm (3.5 x 4.3 inches)
Valves per cylinder: 2
Fuel control: OHV
Cooling system: Air
Gearbox: 4-speed
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Old 12-20-2012, 01:46 PM   #193
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Sure it was a factor. No different than today except all those mentioned and all the new players have their line up and also now copy the HD line up down to the sound. They all have great technology incorporated but the "loyalist and pirates and wannabes" still buy more HDs. That high tech stuff has slowly found its way into the antiquated engineering of the HD thanks to the others and HD has never been better! I love my electronic ignition, ABS, fuel injection, tune by sniff and much better performance in the air cooled line as well as both my Vrods. I still have a lot of respect for HD staying true to their design roots. Often copied, never duplicated.
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855 LBS at the starting line
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Old 12-20-2012, 01:59 PM   #194
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Large4mat View Post


I bought a Street Glide this year, thinking I would sell my 03 VRSCA to help offset the financial damage. I can't bring myself to sell the V-Rod. Both bikes put a smile on my face for different reasons. H-D missed the boat by not paying more attention to how the V-Rod sounds. If the V-Rod had an exhaust system that sounded more like the V-Mod offerings, they would have been unable to keep up with demand....

IMHO nobody can compete with H-D in regard to raw style and paint. The fact that their bikes are just plain fun to ride is icing on the cake.
That is one sweet color combo!
Great looker!
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2011 AHDRA Sportsman Rookie of the year
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Power by Vreeland's Harley-Davidson
http://vreelandsharley.com/?page_id=543

Best 60' 1.438
Best 1/8th 6.181 @ 111.37 MPH
Best 1/4 9.783 @ 136.10 MPH
855 LBS at the starting line
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Old 12-20-2012, 02:05 PM   #195
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I have a V-rod and a Duece

I initially bought a 2008 VRSCD (hadn't owned a bike for 35 years). It had the rear foot controls. For me, it was total agony. I am 55 with a bad knee and a bad hip and it hurt me. I swapped out for forward controls (yes it can be done, for a price) and I love the V-Rod.

That said, for any trip longer than 30 miles I prefer the Duece. I wish it had the power of the V-Rod, but I also dig the rumble of the 88.

I would certainly try a Victory but I would also not mind buying another Harley. (Road King, maybe and possibly a CVO.)
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