First off, I can find 4 different p/ns, 2 in the 06 catalog 29865-04 (Silver) and 29878-06 (Black). Both are $2,999.95.and fit 02-06 VRSCR. The 2 on the M.C. web-site are 29868-06 for 06 VRSCA's @ $2699.95 and 29863-04 for 05 VRSCA's & B's @ $2999.95. Anybody know what the difference is ?
Second, It says " Installation will require complex machining of the original equipment crankcase by an approved Harley Davidson supplier (included in the retail price for domestic vehicles only)". If they pay for the case machining then this doesn't seem like a bad deal (Wiseco quoted me $1100.00 for case machining).
Who does the case machining and does any dealer discount the kits?
Does anybody know what is different about the cams? Spec's looked stock to me.
How much work is done to the heads? Anybody got any pictures of the ports? and chambers of these heads ?
Anybody have any up-dated dyno graphs on a 1250 from K.C.?

Dale

I looked into this kit. There is apparently only one shop that HD authorizes to do the work, and yes the machining costs are included in the purchase price. You have to have your engine completely stripped, the cases sent to this shop, they do the work, and then send you back your cases at which time you put your engine back together. My problem is, I can't find a shop in my area that is familiar with the process, and I'm not sure I want them practicing on my bike. Hope this helps you some.

Zipper's just quoted me $966.00 to bore my case for Falicon sleeves. You would have to send them your case and a sleeve that you are going to use so they can properly fit it.

For a few more thousand, send it to Paul Diener and get a 1430 that will be done right and runs like a bat outta hell. After riding his 1430 at the Rally, I honestly think the 1250 is a waste of time and money.

For a few more thousand, send it to Paul Diener and get a 1430 No doubt, if I had a few more thousand I would. I am going to have to do this in stages as the spare coinage allows. I am just trying to research the best way to go for a big bore right now even though a big arm is what I need for gobs of low end. I am going to do the work myself other than the machine work. Maybe I should rethink it, untill I get the few more thousand. Seems funny to talk about this when some of the stuff I rode for a long time in the past only cost a few thousand. Anyhow doesn't hurt to shop.
Dale

I agree, wait and save some more cash as I have an 05 CVO which comes with the 1250 engine and at KC one was on the dyno and only made a slight amount over some of the stock bikes with bolt ons. If you send it to Paul you can get a 1430 or a 1550 and get some real power and you won't be kicking yourself later because when you find out that you got very little for your money and then have to take it apart again the have the motor done all over. I'm having a 1550 done as we speak and can't wait for the rush. Paul is at Eagle HD in Lafayette Indiana.

I had the 1250 SE kit done to my Street Rod and the dealership sent the cases back to the Factory in KC. Turn around was less than 2 weeks.

No doubt, if I had a few more thousand I would. I am going to have to do this in stages as the spare coinage allows. I am just trying to research the best way to go for a big bore right now even though a big arm is what I need for gobs of low end. I am going to do the work myself other than the machine work. Maybe I should rethink it, untill I get the few more thousand. Seems funny to talk about this when some of the stuff I rode for a long time in the past only cost a few thousand. Anyhow doesn't hurt to shop.
Dale

DALE I WOULD SUGGEST IF YOUR DOING IT IN STAGES BORE THE CASES
FOR THE 4.250 SIZE.THAT WAY WHEN YOU CAN AFFORD THE CRANK YOU
JUST CHANGE THE PISTONS TO STROKER PISTONS. I WOULD ALSO SUGGEST
YOU USE EAGLES PISTONS FOR THE BIG BORE AS THEY ARE THREE RING,NOT
2 RING LIKE WEISCO'S. GOING FROM 1130 TO 1320 YOU'LL FEEL THE DIFFERENCE.YOU CAN CALL ME WITH QUESTIONS 765-448-9132.

I would like to have the set-up rick has...

Thanks Guy's, Rick I will give you a call. I didn't know about the eagle pistons. I can see I have a lot more to learn if I don't want to waste a lot of Time and money.
Dale

I would like to have the set-up rick has...

I DID MINE IN STAGES ALSO,1320,1430,NEXT?$$$$$ :rolleyes:

On the HD website, HD is claiming 10% over stock...Is this correct?

Rick, what are the HP and torque numbers on the 1320?

On the HD website, HD is claiming 10% over stock...Is this correct?

Rick, what are the HP and torque numbers on the 1320?

The numbers from a topless 05 SE (1250 engine) are very close to 122hp / 83 ft-lb. Varies a little from bike to bike I would assume.

The numbers from a topless 05 SE (1250 engine) are very close to 122hp / 83 ft-lb. Varies a little from bike to bike I would assume.

Doesn't seem feasable...some people are making 115/79 with a pipe, filter, and topless...To spend $3,000 on parts, and another $1,500 (estimated) to install it for a total of $4,500...Am I missing something?

I believe that I netted10 or 11 HP based on results at the strip (i.e. about .3 in ET) My dyno results were 123 although I am more confident with my performance numbers racing. We installed because it is HD and we want to showcase their products. I would say that I think the reliability of this set-up is extremely good - and it perfome very well as a bracket racing set-up - extremely consistent. I will start to run for speed this week - gradually increasing my launch revs and shift point - currently my best ET is at 11.17 @119.6MPH (1130 best @ 11.34 @ 115.6 MPH) and hoping to get to the 11.0 or 10.99 range - good air is coming. I did not increase throttle body or change pipes - so I am basicly running an SE CVO type set-up - similar weight with the extra chrome - and no one has accused me of being small - 220 with leathers - bike and rider @ 850 - 860 range.
Kevin

Good question, GerRod.

Is this kit just a set of pistons and barrels or sleeves? Or does it include a cam, etc.

Maybe what it need is a lot of head work, big valves, larger throttle bodies, etc. to make the increased displacement come alive.

Dan G.

I don't have the H.P. and torque graph in front of me right now, but it looked to me like the 1250 really gained a good bit of torque below 5,000. Kinda made the curve a lot better right where you ride most of the time. Makes me think a 1320 would be better yet.
Dale

my best ET is at 11.17 @119.6MPH (1130 best @ 11.34 @ 115.6 MPH)

Those are awesome track numbers and a legitimate increase in performance...the track is the ultimate proving ground for performance...:thumb::thumb: What are your 60s and 330s?

Is this kit just a set of pistons and barrels or sleeves? Or does it include a cam, etc. The 1250 Stage 1 kit includes:
Pistons with rings and wrist pins
Sleeves
revised intake cams
CNC ported heads (bare in the picture)
all required gaskets and hardware
machining of crankcase but not the cost of installation labor for the kit.
Looks like a 15-16 ft.lb increase of torque at 5,500.

I rode the 1430, bad ass.

But to say the 1250 is a waste, you are whistling Dixie.

You put that 1430 in, and add that to the price of the bike, you got a CVO and 3/4. Nevermind the chrome yardage.

The BB1250 is fine for my taste. Certainly not a waste of time and money.

IMHO.
:hiding:

Well, if you're not into all the chrome do dads and just want a seriously fast V-Rod then I would work a deal with Eagle HD. Buy a brand new VRSCA Annodized for $15,995 then have Paul pump it up to a 1550 with all the goodies. Add a pipe and wheels of your choice and be out the door for only a little more than MSRP on a VRSCSE2 (depending on the deal they cut you on the VRSCA).

The other thing I've been considering is buying a salvage bike for <$5000 and having Eagle build it up. For under $20K you could end up with BadRod Jr.......

What page in the parts catalog is the Do Dads? ( he he)

That would be pages 1 through 400 in the accessories catalog ;)

I agree that they aren't that easy to find but there are thousands of salvage companies out there so a diligent search should find one. I found 3 about 2 months ago (after WPB I had the bug) but I strategically didn't bookmark the link :D

does it make sense to install 58mm throttle bodies when doing the 1,250 bb?
What kind of increase would I expect w/58mm over stock on this motor?

Jim I did the HD 1250 BB Kit and did the 58 mm throttle bodies later. I found the new throttle bodies, the HD race tuner and new mapping to make a real nice difference. Here in Canada you may as well be speaking Chinese at the dealer when I went in to ask about the HD Big Bore kit. When you buy the kit it comes with reinforced boxes to send your parts to a place called May Technology in Kansas City. The Stealer / HD pays for the shipping / machining unless you live in Canada where they have taken the kit off the market because they won't pay to have the casings etc. sent to Kansas City. Apparently they do the CVO motors for Harley. Great facility and quick turn around time. Randy at the machine shop tells me they are also doing some work with quite a bit larger bore VROD motors ( 180 HP ) etc. The 1250 HD Big Bore kit doesn't void your warranty either and its still a reliable ride. My two cents.

Those are awesome track numbers and a legitimate increase in performance...the track is the ultimate proving ground for performance...:thumb::thumb: What are your 60s and 330s?

Here are numbers from first day at the track with an analysis from a computer simulation following - the pass with the 119MPH was about a month later - KSP

Originally Posted by kspz3
1250 kit, shifter, topless, no air cleaner, 22/64 chain drive, pingel electric shifter, lower 1", 860 lbs. bike and rider, SE V-Mod - best pass first day of the season
R/T .026
60' 1.646
330 4.566
1/8 7.069
MPH 97.61
1000' 9.276
1/4 11.177
MPH 117.57
71 degrees, 16% Humidity, 28.85, 1.0149 2200 Adj Alt



Here are some numbers from a simulator for those who may want a reference on 0-60 and 0-100MPH and speeds at distances.

0-60 mph: 2.97 Seconds
0-100 mph: 7.32 Seconds
60 ft: 1.65 @ 43.95
330 ft: 4.57 @ 79.88
1/8 mile: 7.06 @ 97.78 (99.32 actual)
1000 ft: 9.26 @ 110.85
1/4 mile: 11.17 @ 117.02 (117.62 actual)
Max Accel: 1.167 G

Patm,
Thanks, just the info I need.
Where did you get 58mm throttle bodies? Can you buy them or are the stock ones machined?
I'm a novice on them, but my engine is being reassembled now (1,250 pro BB kit) and I want to pass the info along.
Thanks

Patm,
Thanks, just the info I need.
Where did you get 58mm throttle bodies? Can you buy them or are the stock ones machined?
I'm a novice on them, but my engine is being reassembled now (1,250 pro BB kit) and I want to pass the info along.
Thanks


Jim, you can get 58mm Throttle bodies from Zippers, or have your stock ones bored out (less expensive), Cycle Rama (did mine). Either case you will need 58mm velocity stacks (zippers carries them).

Jim, give Clay @ Wilwert's HD a call, 1-800-359-1980 he'll fix you up and send you the new ones first for exchange.

Had the 1250 done on 05 B at 181 miles on new bike. Someone wrote above the 1250cc BB done by HD won't void warranty- not according to customer service at HD: Factory says it did void warranty but local dealer (which was sold to a new owner a few weeks ago now so ???) said they would honor the 7 year extended warranty including on the engine mods they did (before the new owner).

You do get about 10-11 more HP with accompanying torque, but really don't feel that much difference. If I had it to do over would go for 1400+ cc rather than 1250.

Also, going from 1130 cc to 1250 cc almost doubled my annual insurance premium with Foremost.

Also, going from 1130 cc to 1250 cc almost doubled my annual insurance premium with Foremost.


Foremost is the absolute highest for insurance. Try Geico. They have always been the lowest for me. Even on sportbikes.

I did price Geico and some others, Foremost through HOG gave best price although there was one other company also through HOG that was only about $30 more than Foremost. Maybe it is NM, less than 2 million people here, high pedestrian fatalities and repeated DUI arrests, they can't seem to keep them off the road here.

Interesting though is I priced Foremost through AARP, was more than double what got the same insurance for through HOG. I have no tickets, no insurance claims of any kind in over 25 years. . .

Go figure.

Original point was, insurance companies seem to price largely based on displacement and there seems to be an increase about 1200 cc. I priced a Sporty before getting the V, and the insurance for the Sporty, same year, and several thousands $ less purchase price for the Sporty, insurance was about 150% more for the Sporty, even though a much less powerful bike, because of engine displacement.

Thanks for the info. Sounds like a state thing with higher incidence ratios.

Had the 1250 done on 05 B at 181 miles on new bike. Someone wrote above the 1250cc BB done by HD won't void warranty- not according to customer service at HD: Factory says it did void warranty but local dealer (which was sold to a new owner a few weeks ago now so ???) said they would honor the 7 year extended warranty including on the engine mods they did (before the new owner).

You do get about 10-11 more HP with accompanying torque, but really don't feel that much difference. If I had it to do over would go for 1400+ cc rather than 1250.

Also, going from 1130 cc to 1250 cc almost doubled my annual insurance premium with Foremost.


Why would you tell the insurance company that you increased the cc? Where you trying to get coverage on the $$ spent to do the upgrade?

:popcorn

???????????????

dee dee dee

Man, this thread is soooo last year............

I thought that Harley warrantied the 1250 kit if the stealer did the work.

Doesn't seem feasable...some people are making 115/79 with a pipe, filter, and topless...To spend $3,000 on parts, and another $1,500 (estimated) to install it for a total of $4,500...Am I missing something?


Yep, you get a free HD receipt with it... lol

I"ve been lurking a bit and I gotta tell ya, 10% gain for almost $5k is a bunch. $5k looks like it will get you a turbo (at 40+hp) or some serious machine work if you dont get it thru HD.